The War in the Ukraine

sheogorath

Major
Registered Member
I find it rather strange that they can't field the missile.


For all the talk of corruption in Russia, Ukraine takes the cake, even if it people now wants to pretend that isnt the case

This has made sure that they dilapidated all the industrial and technical base the USSR left them with and havent been able to expand upon it in any relevant capacity. Which is why they can make one or two prototypes and then things fall through.

The loss is more evident in the AFV deparment, an area we're they still retained a lot of the know-how but fulfilling the Thai order was a struggle, or the embarassment of the cracked iraqui BTR hulls.

This is made worse by the fact that in every area, the market offers more proven and reliable alternatives. Why buy an ukranian transport plane with no existing line nor tooling and unproven performance when you could buy even chinese alternatives who perform better?.

This left them too cash strapped to finance or build anything, along with whatever gets stolen.


There's only one response to this but US is still iffy in giving ATACMS.
Is not like they are that many ATACMS left in the first place nor like the Russians don't have the means to shoot them down.

And it isnt a wunderwaffen, like none of the previous weapons delivered were
I guess US figures these attacks make Ukraine thee victim without changing anything in favor of Russia at the frontlines
Thats a lot of assumptions.
 

SolarWarden

Junior Member
Registered Member
Is not like they are that many ATACMS left in the first place nor like the Russians don't have the means to shoot them down.

And it isnt a wunderwaffen, like none of the previous weapons delivered were
There's close to 3k ATACMS left the M39's were upgraded to M48/M57

ATACMS doesn't fly like a ballistic missile.

It maneuvers at mach speed when it descends
Thats a lot of assumptions.
Russians are still losing ground these drone attacks have changed nothing for Russia... yet.
 

SolarWarden

Junior Member
Registered Member
You know.. Ukraine can play the same game. They always have the options ordering hundreds of cheap Chinese drones and load them with explosive.

This is basically a repeat on what happen in Sevastopol some weeks ago, but Ukraine use commercial drone. These piston engined drones can reach great distance. Even Orlan can actually reach 1500 km if it convert every single drop of its endurance into range. They can comfortably reach any targets in Russia. and their RCS is low enough and cheap enough to be deployed in numbers.

and the best thing of all, you can easily calculate them....all you need to do is gather information on the drone's endurance and use Raymer's simplified endurance to range equation.

Also in ballistic missile department.. have you ever wonder why Ukrainian never seem able to field their Iskander equivalent, the Grom/Hrim-II despite supposed co-development with Saudi ?. Ukraine is not some country without anything you know.. they have Yuzhnoye design bureau, a fully functional missile design bureau with great track record. I find it rather strange that they can't field the missile.
Yeah talk about the perfect cruise missile for Ukraine. So cheap and effective against static targets. Problem is Ukraine after 2014 their doctrine started to change to a more western style.
 

Temstar

Brigadier
Registered Member

BlackWindMnt

Captain
Registered Member
Kiev got pounded again today by multiple waves of UAV, that's nothing new. But what does seem to be new is how AFU is dealing with it:

They're going crazy there with searchlights and AAA like it's 1945
You would think the west would have something automated for Ukraine using radar and optical to target those UAV?
 

tabu

Junior Member
Registered Member
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Iran secretly sends military to frontline in UkraineIran is secretly sending its troops to the frontline in Ukraine to help train Russian troops in controlling kamikaze drones, the Daily Mail has reported.

Some 50 Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) specialists have reportedly been sent to the southern and eastern front with hundreds of Shahed-136 drones.

IRGC troops were reportedly deployed in Dzhankoy in Crimea and Kherson in the south, where they have likely already been destroyed.

"At least one of the Iranian training groups has recently been hit and the rest are being actively hunted down. We have long been concerned about IRGC specialists assisting Russia in their horrific attacks on civilians and of course they are being targeted," a Ukrainian source told the Mirror.
 

Zichan

Junior Member
Registered Member
Kiev got pounded again today by multiple waves of UAV, that's nothing new. But what does seem to be new is how AFU is dealing with it:

They're going crazy there with searchlights and AAA like it's 1945
The AAA looks as effective as Iraqi one in 1991.

What happened to the Gepards and other radar controlled AAA?

For urban and critical infrastructure protection, Ukraine would be well served with Rheinmetal 35mm C-RAM guns.
 

tankphobia

Senior Member
Registered Member
The AAA looks as effective as Iraqi one in 1991.

What happened to the Gepards and other radar controlled AAA?

For urban and critical infrastructure protection, Ukraine would be well served with Rheinmetal 35mm C-RAM guns.
Apparently they are attached to HIMARS rather then being spent in cities. Either way not enough of them to make a difference here. Mass use of ZSU-23s on top of high-rises might be a better solution here.
 
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