Taiwan plans to build 500 cruise missiles

KYli

Brigadier
SampanViking said:
Wow!! It has been busy here tonight.
Busy it is, but watch out. Golly is concern about this thing is off topic.
Without posting loads of quotes lets try and answer some main points. Chen may try to do something with Japan like er ...... buy some missiles:confused:
but ultimately I think Japan realises it can probably get more out of China for not associating with Taiwan than it could ever get by associating with Chen. Not so far fetched, constructive talks have been going on behind the scenes this week between China and Japan.
As too China removing its missiles. This is something it will be doing in order to show appreciation with a more friendly Taiwanese Administration. I would not rule out a few very public deployment reductions, over the next couple of years in response to assurances or appeals from the KMT as to their good intentions when they regain office.
I agreed, if Taiwanese administration show some sign of good will that could happen.
Ultimately though I think Chen has little room for maneouver in any meaningful sense, and dramatic gestures will only bring denunciation from even his best "friends" abroad. Yes I do not discount that Army Officers and Judges etc will consider their future prospects beyond the next two years very carefully.
I will never understimate Chen ability. Chen had time and time show his ability to playing with fire. When Chen won the election in 2000, I fellow Chen's new closely. My conclusion is Chen is very capable person. So when it is 2004 election, I have no doubt he will win when others think otherwise.
As for any Cruise Missiles, do you seriously believe the US would reward Chen with such weapons; even if he could get the expenditure through the Pan Blue dominated legislature, after what he has said and done, against US wishes over the last month?

I really do not think so
I think you are wrong here. Taiwan is builting their own cruise missiles without direct US help. There are nothing US could do or will do. Actually Taiwan already have shorter version of Cruise missiles that could hit targets at Fujian.
 

taijisheng

New Member
Gollevainen said:
well this is almoust as stubid to say that when Finnish army has relationships to Bundeswehr, The Nazis are going to re-intervene into Russia. Comon, little sensibility may I ask? Thougth it much fit in chinese nationalistic rubbish to make up conspiracy theoryes over sixty years old event, I think the clever rest of us knows that the real world functions in bit different levels. So dont speed up this allready edgy threads up coming closure by flaming another japanese bashing contest.:eek:ff

I can only forgive you for your ignorence on this subject, do some more study next time please before calling ppl stupid about something you obviously know too little about.
 

taijisheng

New Member
I think china want to stop pointing those missles at taiwan too, but it can't happen while a pro-independace taiwanese persident is at power. When a KMT president comes to power, I am sure he only need to ask and it will be done.
 

Gollevainen

Colonel
VIP Professional
Registered Member
I can only forgive you for your ignorence on this subject, do some more study next time please before calling ppl stupid about something you obviously know too little about.


are you sure you wanna go out on that road:nono: :nono: ??
This thread is about Taiwan, an issue that can hardly be discussed civilized, and getting Japan dragged on it is just too dangerous.

So if it is said in the rules, Presented by so many examples, that we in this forum dont like things to go offtopic, expecially in threads considering Taiwan and Japan, So Yeas i preserve a rigth to call someone or something stubid. I dont know about you But at this point it cannot be nothing more than act of stubidity to ignore SO clear rules like that!
 
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SampanViking

The Capitalist
Staff member
Super Moderator
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Hi tajisheng

Oh my word, lets not go there;)

Hi KYli

I will never understimate Chen ability. Chen had time and time show his ability to playing with fire. When Chen won the election in 2000, I fellow Chen's new closely. My conclusion is Chen is very capable person. So when it is 2004 election, I have no doubt he will win when others think otherwise.

Nor do I he is very wily, but if he has only minority support at home and no International Support, my question is what exactly can he do?

He has tried to develp links with other Regional countries (India most recently) but Chinese influence ensures these overtures are rebuffed. Japan ultimately does a huge amount of business with China and wants to resolve its differences. Interefering in Taiwan would be at least an "Unfriendly and Provocative Act" It just is not going to happen.

It not that he would not try to do anything, but I see him as a caged Tiger, no matter what he does he is still behind bars.

If you have any inklings do share.

I think you are wrong here. Taiwan is builting their own cruise missiles without direct US help. There are nothing US could do or will do. Actually Taiwan already have shorter version of Cruise missiles that could hit targets at Fujian
.

Bombs are bombs and no doubt Taiwan has the technology to build them. Can Chen get them funded though as the LY probably needs to give its consent and Pan Blue now have a majority.
Domestic missiles are not such a worry, it is foriegn ones with all the indications of support that this supply implies.
 
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D

Deleted member 675

Guest
KYli said:
Nobody keep their missiles in reserve, it will take forever to get ready. Whether they might not load missiles with munition but US and Russia do have the ability to fire their missiles in matter of minutes. China do not have the ability.

As I said, why is it necessary to be able to fire the missiles in minutes? It isn't.

The only meaningful peaceful settlement between China and Taiwan could only go both ways, until somebody in Taiwan willing to seriously talk to China.

Taiwan wants to talk to China, but Beijing insists that everyone agrees to its position first. China should be the one to be more flexible, not Taiwan.

Any radical move from China will only mean weakness in front of chinese people.

You'll have to excuse me, but I think that's bull. The missile build-up is a result of too many generals and politicians thinking with their dicks and not their brains. Pointing missiles at Taiwan makes the people there more angry towards the mainland. So perhaps they're scared now - that's not good. Scared people can react in unpredictable ways. Perhaps in the near future they might decide that now's the time to get their independence, before China has even more missiles.

If China wants Taiwan back, Beijing is going to have to take the stick from out of its arse and actually talk to whoever the elected leader in Taiwan is. Chinese politicians shake hands with people like Robert Mugabe, so it's a bit rich for them to complain about someone that is far more tame by comparison.

A gesture of friendship is a gesture of friendship. I don't buy macho crap about appearing "weak". It would be so easy to have another chat with Ma and then announce a "friendship movement" or whatever and reduce the number of missiles. The Blues and Beijing would get all the credit and the Greens would lose out. End of story.
 

KYli

Brigadier
SampanViking said:
Nor do I he is very wily but if he has only minority support at home and no International Support, my question is what exactly can he do?

He has tried to develp links with other Regional countries (India most recently) but Chinese influence ensures these overtures are rebuffed. Japan ultimately does a huge amount of business with China and wants to resolve its differences. Interefering in Taiwan would be at least an "Unfriendly and Provocative Act" It just is not going to happen.

It not that he would not try to do anything, but I see him as a caged Tiger, no matter what he does he is still behind bars.

If you have any inklings do share.
Chen could try to change the constitution, this is a very dangerous move because it might involve changing Taiwan name, sovereignty and flag. There are a lot of talk in the DPP and Pan green that 2008 would be best time to acheive indenpendent, because of the Olympic.

The another thing Chen could do is to hold a referendum of independent.

I can't find a link in english. I read most of these in the Liberty time which is the biggest Pan green newspaper.
.
Bombs are bombs and no doubt Taiwan has the technology to build them. Can Chen get them funded though as the LY probably needs to give its consent and Pan Blue now have a majority.
Domestic missiles are not such a worry, it is foriegn ones with all the indications of support that this supply implies.
Well, I doubt few hundred cruise missiles are much of threat, but Taiwan is trying to develop the longer range cruise missiles so they could hit shanghai and HK. Chen will not have problem to contain the funds, Pan-blue will not stop everything in the defense. This will make them look bad, and I think Chen can allocate the funds necessary for the project from annul defence budget.

FuManChu said:
As I said, why is it necessary to be able to fire the missiles in minutes? It isn't.
Why, because other countries have the ability to do it. China needs to have the missiles ready in time of conflict. You don't want the enemies to hit you first. Even other countries fire their missiles first, you could still retaliate quickly.


Taiwan wants to talk to China, but Beijing insists that everyone agrees to its position first. China should be the one to be more flexible, not Taiwan.
China have already become very flexible. If Taiwan have the intention of talk, Beijing is willing to set awy the position first. The three links are good example, china is saying that the business groups could led the talk first.


You'll have to excuse me, but I think that's bull. The missile build-up is a result of too many generals and politicians thinking with their dicks and not their brains. Pointing missiles at Taiwan makes the people there more angry towards the mainland. So perhaps they're scared now - that's not good. Scared people can react in unpredictable ways. Perhaps in the near future they might decide that now's the time to get their independence, before China has even more missiles.
Well, who know. Maybe the other way around too. The missiles might have prevent the Pan-green to use their brain instead of their dick. So they wouldn't do anything suicidal.
If China wants Taiwan back, Beijing is going to have to take the stick from out of its arse and actually talk to whoever the elected leader in Taiwan is. Chinese politicians shake hands with people like Robert Mugabe, so it's a bit rich for them to complain about someone that is far more tame by comparison.
China might have different opinion about Robert Mugabe than you have, but I do agree China need to talk to Taiwan. But I doubt Chen is a man that can be trust, he do not have a good reputation,
A gesture of friendship is a gesture of friendship. I don't buy macho crap about appearing "weak". It would be so easy to have another chat with Ma and then announce a "friendship movement" or whatever and reduce the number of missiles. The Blues and Beijing would get all the credit and the Greens would lose out. End of story.
I already said it is possible for China to reduce the missiles, but there should be some movement from both sides. So it will look as gesture of friendship not weakness. If Ma come to China, and show he is willing to talk. That could be a possibility but will Ma come to China before 2008.
 
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taijisheng

New Member
Gollevainen said:
are you sure you wanna go out on that road:nono: :nono: ??
This thread is about Taiwan, an issue that can hardly be discussed civilized, and getting Japan dragged on it is just too dangerous.

So if it is said in the rules, Presented by so many examples, that we in this forum dont like things to go offtopic, expecially in threads considering Taiwan and Japan, So Yeas i preserve a rigth to call someone or something stubid. I dont know about you But at this point it cannot be nothing more than act of stubidity to ignore SO clear rules like that!

I didn't say anything uncivillized, I went a bit off topic maybe but it was still about Taiwan, and I wasn't the one who mentioned Japan first nor the only one who mentioned it.

And really, save all these red text/shouting/mod power stuff, it's so childisch.
:rofl: :eek:ff
 
D

Deleted member 675

Guest
KYli said:
China have already become very flexible. If Taiwan have the intention of talk, Beijing is willing to set awy the position first.

Sorry, how is China's position flexible? It refuses to meet with Chen simply because it doesn't like his position. He would like to talk with Beijing, but the last thing he is going to do is say "ok, yes Taiwan is a part of China". He doesn't believe it, nor does he want it to be.

Normally in negotiation you talk with whoever is available and ignore the things you can't agree on until you are at least talking. Britain has held talks with Robert Mugabe, with Hamas in Palestine, Iran - and many other nasty regimes. We'd like nothing better than to throw them into a bottomless pit, but given that isn't possible we have been willing to talk to at least see if we can reach some sort of agreement.

Beijing, on the other hand, insists that Taiwanese politicians agree with its position first. That is not negotiation by any stretch of the imagination. It's about time the old farts on the mainland realised that a change in administration will not hasten unification one jot. They're wasting precious time by sulking just because Chen won't do as they say.
 

Gollevainen

Colonel
VIP Professional
Registered Member
And really, save all these red text/shouting/mod power stuff, it's so childisch.

showing off???

Red text is preserved only for moderation purposes so when You(or anyone else) see it in the 'field' expecially used by moderator, You migth consider that he is beeing moderating something at the moment. This forum has already good examples of what happens when members try to think themselves atop rules and thinking that they can go offtopic when ever they want and ignore moderators actions. Going offtopic isent a sin that migth earn your a warning in this forum, but ignoring moderators counsel and continue ass-rubbing after it will earn you a warning. So consider yourself warned. Now do this one more time and You get banned for good.

If you have proplems whit our moderation policy or rules, contact Webmaster or Dongfeng, not me, Im not intresed in whining over so simple matter like rules.
 
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