Shanghai Cooperation Organisation (SCO) and Global South strategic cooperation

luminary said:

Russia has an obsession of "balancing" China because it is the same type of imperialist nation as the US. They are continuing to practice the divide and conquer strategy, hoping that another Asiatic power will somehow cut China down so they can escape from China's immense economic gravity.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

to join in what they see as Russia's new global bloc. National figures continue to champion solely Russia as the one true garden,

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

The truth is that Russians wouldn't be so offended by Western "Russophobia" if they didn't see themselves as white brethren and wish to be reaccepted and rejoined with their kind. Their anxieties will be only quelled by a proper Sinification of their country.


Thoughts on BRICS+:
Ideally BRICS+ should include all the remaining G20 nations that are currently alienated from this US-led System: Indonesia, Saudi Arabia and Turkey, plus Argentina and Mexico. This would be a direct challenge as it would include Turkey (in NATO) and Mexico (in NAFTA).

The G20 would then be split down the middle 10 vs 10, with the US, Japan, Germany, UK, France, Italy, Canada, Australia, South Korea and the EU versus an expanded BRICS+.

Click to expand...

Don't forget it was in 2005 when India and Pakistan got their observer status in the SCO, the Great financial Crisis didn't even happen yet. The big western geopolitical moves weren't even telegraphed until in 2007 if im not mistaken. When the west said they will add Ukraine and Georgia to their NATO coalition. That was pretty much the start of Russia and the West breaking up and the crimean war would take place 7 years later. That was also a time when Europe still had some strong leadership to give the illusion that they were an independent group of nations and not US vassals. The US didn't even started their pivot to Asia yet at that time. Now looking back in 2023 the world has changed so much it feels like i have lived multiple lifetimes in the past 1.5 decade or so.

I do agree that Russia or more specifically the Russian people still sees itself/themselves as a (traditional/orthodox)western nation, you can see it on twitter a lot of russia accounts also sport the US flag in their name or profile. It will take like 2~3 decades before new generations of Russia has grown up in a more Asian century. I expect the same to happen with Asians in South East Asia it will take some time before the next generation that grew up in a Asian Century gets into politics or become a public figure.

Biscuits said:

Even if China is having success with expansions right now, it should not be forgotten that Russia is THE single most important territory that must remain controlled.

Russian food, oil, ores and wood will not only keep China alive indefinitely, but ensure that China can always mobilize properly and win the industrial war.

The war in Ukraine is a massive geopolitical boon, which should be exploited as much as possible, in order to strengthen ties. Not just diplomatic agreements, but the exchange of goods and people, as well as the standardisation of education, industries and tools.

Some European nationalists have compared Russia to mongols as an insult. As I see it, it is far better to be a Mongol than to be a Tsarist. The Mongols were a free people, each owning their own household and means of production. The Tsar, like all other European autocrats, treated their subjects like chattel and ruled through crown appointed oligarchs.

The Asian ruled Russian could choose whichever career he had the means to pursue, the European ruled Russian was bound on his own land plot for his whole life, doomed to toil like a machine for an "aristocrat", who distribute back to him the bare minimum he needed to survive.

But did Russia's history with Europe not at least give them western technology? No. Japan acquired the same with minimal struggle and defeated the Tsarist Russian almost effortlessly. China acquired better technology without ever prostrating itself or going to war over it.

Europe has truly brought nothing to Russia except autocracy, acceptance of degenerate western corruption and dehumanization. It's time to get rid of the European Russian mindset.

Click to expand...

In my opinion, it is not the Russian nationalists who see themselves as more European so to speak, I frequent Russian channels and have Russian nationalist friends. Even the most important organizations and nationalist people see China as an example of what the USSR should have become in its reforms, which in China succeeded and in the USSR failed. There is a certain envy and nostalgia for what could have been, but in general China is seen in a very positive way and as an example to follow in many aspects by all of them.

The most "European" are not the Tzarists, who see themselves as Russians, a mixture of Asia and Europe, but the "liberals", i.e. the people who want to live in Hollywood, who want to dress and have Western values, go to Starbucks etc.
These were also the ones who destroyed the USSR to be able to eat at Macdonalds, so, already in the 90s you find communists and nationalists fighting together in the streets against pro-western liberals ...

Photos from 1993:


Hollywood and liberalism in general is undoubtedly Washington's best weapon all around the world, not just Russia.

BlackWindMnt said:

I do agree that Russia or more specifically the Russian people still sees itself/themselves as a (traditional/orthodox)western nation, you can see it on twitter a lot of russia accounts also sport the US flag in their name or profile. It will take like 2~3 decades before new generations of Russia has grown up in a more Asian century. I expect the same to happen with Asians in South East Asia it will take some time before the next generation that grew up in a Asian Century gets into politics or become a public figure.

Click to expand...

I also disagree.
No Russian uses Twitter. That's about Americans, who see Russia as a savior of their own civilization, the Orthodox don't see themselves as Westerners, in fact, the Orthodox don't think well of Catholics and Protestants.
The Catholics tried to destroy Russia and Orthodoxy in general on many occasions, the Russian founding myth par excellence is the destruction of the Germanic CRUSADERS by St. Alexander Nevsky in the battle on the thread.
Generally speaking, all Orthodox in the world remember how the Crusaders destroyed Byzantium.

Do not confuse the real Russia, with the image Westerners have of Russia and the one you see on Twitter.

marcos1234 said:

In my opinion, it is not the Russian nationalists who see themselves as more European so to speak, I frequent Russian channels and have Russian nationalist friends. Even the most important organizations and nationalist people see China as an example of what the USSR should have become in its reforms, which in China succeeded and in the USSR failed. There is a certain envy and nostalgia for what could have been, but in general China is seen in a very positive way and as an example to follow in many aspects by all of them.

The most "European" are not the Tzarists, who see themselves as Russians, a mixture of Asia and Europe, but the "liberals", i.e. the people who want to live in Hollywood, who want to dress and have Western values, go to Starbucks etc.
These were also the ones who destroyed the USSR to be able to eat at Macdonalds, so, already in the 90s you find communists and nationalists fighting together in the streets against pro-western liberals ...

Photos from 1993:
View attachment 114583View attachment 114584

Hollywood and liberalism in general is undoubtedly Washington's best weapon all around the world, not just Russia.


I also disagree.
No Russian uses Twitter. That's about Americans, who see Russia as a savior of their own civilization, the Orthodox don't see themselves as Westerners, in fact, the Orthodox don't think well of Catholics and Protestants.
The Catholics tried to destroy Russia and Orthodoxy in general on many occasions, the Russian founding myth par excellence is the destruction of the Germanic CRUSADERS by St. Alexander Nevsky in the battle on the thread.
Generally speaking, all Orthodox in the world remember how the Crusaders destroyed Byzantium.

Do not confuse the real Russia, with the image Westerners have of Russia and the one you see on Twitter.

Click to expand...

You make a good point about what I perceived as Russian on western socialmedia. I should be more mindful of the more biased samples on western social networks. It's just so easy to forgot that fact.

so take a look at this

South Africa asking for China's help to guarantee PV supply to them. That's something previously only thought of for hydrocarbons or coal when it comes to energy security.

So I wonder if this will be a trend for future where countries around global south will just seek China to not only supply their solar panels wind turbines but also all the energy storage, smart grid, green hydrogen and other things to allow them to access cheap energy

Just as America's shale boom had huge geopolitical implications, I see an even bigger renewable boom coming in China.

China loves taking control of various countries energy grids. I could see it here as a big way in gaining control of energy of countries around the world

AssassinsMace said:

India is a fence sitter. They don't want to be caught on the wrong side. They want to make sure they end up on the winning side. Even if they decided to join the West, they don't know if the West would win against China. If China wins, they're screwed.

Click to expand...

True definition of a snake oil salesman and snake charmer.

CNCEC has signed MOU with aeon (azot???) group to build a 1 million ton/year methanol project in Volgograd

says green methanol in the first link, but I haven't seen any other evidence of it like here
no mention of green in there. Still a significant project though

CMEC is building the power grid in Ecuador. Again, just taking over power industry in south America

Signing 510 million deals with Serbia

China/Africa expo coming soon. Should enhance trade ties

A lot of large projects that are more strategic in nature

after the shameful treatment of South African president by Poland
I'm sure African continent understand firmly that Europeans can't be trusted

While China trains South African police

Saudi Arabia welcomes naval security alliance with Iran

Iranian President Ebrahim Raisi told the Saudi FM that 'only the enemies of Muslim nations' oppose the Iran-Saudi rapprochement
By News Desk - June 18 2023


(Photo Credit: AFP)


Saudi Foreign Minister Prince Faisal bin Farhan met with Iranian authorities in Tehran on 17 June in the latest step in the restoration of diplomatic ties between the two former regional rivals.

“I would like to refer to the importance of cooperation between the two countries on regional security, especially the security of maritime navigation … and the importance of cooperation among all regional countries to ensure that it is free of weapons of mass destruction,” Prince Faisal said during a joint news conference with his Iranian counterpart Hossein Amir-Abdollahian.

His statement comes on the heels of reports that the Islamic Republic is working alongside Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Qatar, Bahrain, Iraq, Pakistan, and India, to form a “” to boost security in the northern Indian Ocean.

“Iran has never equated security with militarism but sees it as a broad concept including political, cultural, social, economic, and trade aspects,” Amir-Abdollahian told reporters on Saturday.

Bin Farhan later met with Iranian President Ebrahim Raisi and delivered an invitation from Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman (MbS) and King Salman urging him to visit the kingdom.

The top Saudi diplomat also told Raisi that relations between Tehran and Riyadh have entered a “golden phase,” revealing that King Salman ordered various working groups to boost relations with Iran to a “strategic level.”

For his part, Raisi welcomed the restoration of ties with Riyadh and stressed that only the “enemies” of Muslim nations are bothered by this new reality.

“Only the enemies of Muslims, not least the Zionist regime, are upset with the enhancement of cooperation between Iran and Saudi Arabia,” the Iranian president said.

“The Zionist regime is not only an enemy of the Palestinians but a threat to all Muslims,” he added before warning that normalizing ties with Israel would “in no way enhance security.”

“It is possible to overcome problems through cooperation and dialogue among regional countries, and there is no need for foreign intervention to that end,” Raisi stressed.

As Iran and Saudi Arabia continue to restore ties under a Chinese-brokered deal, the US has been in recent weeks to secure Saudi normalization with Israel in a bid to reestablish its presence in West Asia.

However, several US officials who spoke with the New York Times on Saturday say Joe Biden’s diplomatic efforts have “less than 50 percent” chance of succeeding.

Alright, looks like another step here for nuclear cooperation bw china & Pakistan.

A good write up by a professional who knows about the details of China-India relationship. A glance from China's elite perspective, India is definitely in the western camp and is solidly onboard the anti-China train now. I don't think India's new stance will change even if Modi leaves office.

China needs to roll out more multilateral orgs that exclude India, e.g., China+Central Asia 5, China + Afghanistan neighbours. With enough of these organizations, SCO can finally be buried.