Intrepid
Major
The question was whether you can hear the type of the ship. I think, you can be lucky to hear at least the number of screws.
PLAN Aircraft Carrier programme...(Closed)
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asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
Reminds me of the old days when we used to watch the carrier in port for years hoping for it to be commissioned one day
Re: J-15 Carrier Multirole Fighter thread
I think some people (myself included) a few years ago definitely thought the PLAN would be progressing a little faster than they seem to be doing, but over the last while I've began to realize just how vast a challenge actually lies in front of them, and that developing a carrier capability is not going to show immediate results.
As for ship refit, again, I don't consider it too soon since the ship entered service. I'm sure they aren't doing any major changes, but will involve a variety of smaller subsystem switches or additions from lessons they learned at sea.
They've definitely not been out at sea as often as we would like, but I suspect they were using that time at sea less to train and more to develop the specific theories, manuals, and ground work to develop an overall doctrine they want to train upon. The PLAN have definitely been preparing for carriers many years, but at the end of the day they only received their first ship of this type a year and a half ago. To train vigorously this soon would actually seem a little irresponsible to me
I think some people (myself included) a few years ago definitely thought the PLAN would be progressing a little faster than they seem to be doing, but over the last while I've began to realize just how vast a challenge actually lies in front of them, and that developing a carrier capability is not going to show immediate results.
As for ship refit, again, I don't consider it too soon since the ship entered service. I'm sure they aren't doing any major changes, but will involve a variety of smaller subsystem switches or additions from lessons they learned at sea.
They've definitely not been out at sea as often as we would like, but I suspect they were using that time at sea less to train and more to develop the specific theories, manuals, and ground work to develop an overall doctrine they want to train upon. The PLAN have definitely been preparing for carriers many years, but at the end of the day they only received their first ship of this type a year and a half ago. To train vigorously this soon would actually seem a little irresponsible to me
Re: J-15 Carrier Multirole Fighter thread
Excellent post so excellent in fact I copied it and re-posted it here in this thread.
The only statement I disagree with is;
In my experience you can never slack up on the training.
However I must state..Also it is important to allow some time for shipmates to catch their breath..slow down a little from the training mode and reflect on what they have learned. Give them time to relax, spend time with their families etc..etc.. Then hit the training cycle again.
Excellent post so excellent in fact I copied it and re-posted it here in this thread.
The only statement I disagree with is;
In my experience you can never slack up on the training.
However I must state..Also it is important to allow some time for shipmates to catch their breath..slow down a little from the training mode and reflect on what they have learned. Give them time to relax, spend time with their families etc..etc.. Then hit the training cycle again.
Regarding training, I mean that it may be dangerous or inefficient to go out to sea too much at such an early stage when they probably didn't even have a chance to test their theory written manuals and basic procedures yet, let alone revise them under a little bit of practice at sea (which is what I suspect they've been doing over the last year).
And of course, it takes time to translate that experience into something which superiors can use to develop into more concrete standards, procedures and doctrines (which is what I suspect the sailors would've been doing when the ship was dockside).
Once they have a more refined idea of how they want to operate the ship, they would probably go out to sea much more, and that is where training comes useful, because they can actually have some standards and procedures to practice with, whereas in earlier stages they'd be going at it almost blindly.
Of course, the above applies to the commissioning of all new classes of ships, but recalling the PLAN have never operated a carrier before (nor any ship with such a large flight deck), and that they have little to no foreign help, and that the ship itself is of an untested class with equipment developed by a nation with no previous experience in carrier subsystems, I think their current rate of sea going is in line with expectations.
It would be nice if they were faster, but at the same time I doubt they have been spending their days dockside twiddling thumbs.
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Putting it another way, the USN have had decades of carrier operation to develop tried and true standards, procedures and doctrines, which allows them to train their crews and go out to sea often with knowledge of what is right and what is wrong and what the yardstick of performance they need for their ship.
The PLAN is at the early stage stage where they probably are only beginning to understand what is right and wrong and what they can expect of their crew. Once they have that down, I expect more vigorous training will follow.
In some ways, the liaoning is indeed an experiment and test ship at present.
And of course, it takes time to translate that experience into something which superiors can use to develop into more concrete standards, procedures and doctrines (which is what I suspect the sailors would've been doing when the ship was dockside).
Once they have a more refined idea of how they want to operate the ship, they would probably go out to sea much more, and that is where training comes useful, because they can actually have some standards and procedures to practice with, whereas in earlier stages they'd be going at it almost blindly.
Of course, the above applies to the commissioning of all new classes of ships, but recalling the PLAN have never operated a carrier before (nor any ship with such a large flight deck), and that they have little to no foreign help, and that the ship itself is of an untested class with equipment developed by a nation with no previous experience in carrier subsystems, I think their current rate of sea going is in line with expectations.
It would be nice if they were faster, but at the same time I doubt they have been spending their days dockside twiddling thumbs.
---
Putting it another way, the USN have had decades of carrier operation to develop tried and true standards, procedures and doctrines, which allows them to train their crews and go out to sea often with knowledge of what is right and what is wrong and what the yardstick of performance they need for their ship.
The PLAN is at the early stage stage where they probably are only beginning to understand what is right and wrong and what they can expect of their crew. Once they have that down, I expect more vigorous training will follow.
In some ways, the liaoning is indeed an experiment and test ship at present.
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Once again excellent post Bltizo. Excellent.
Right now they are more than likely studying the "hic-ups and goofs" made in the last couple of years and are working hard to make sure mistakes are corrected. And I'm sure they are making their own CV operation doctrine to fit the needs of the PLAN future operations.
Perhaps when the ship emerges from the shipyard in a few months will will see a quicker pace of operations.
kwaigonegin
Colonel
I'll offer my services to PLAN and help them improve deck handling and repositioning of man and materials safely..
I'll teach them how to increase sortie generation rates and to maximize effectiveness in aircraft handling, flow and storage.
Those things are as much art as science and since it's not exactly trade secrets I don't helping fellow sailors out. From my experience, I've observed that the better trained the person is the more professional they become. Contrary to popular beliefs, It's the untrained or undertrained folks that are the most dangerous and unpredictable....
I'll even teach them how to shoot properly.
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I'll offer my services to PLAN and help them improve deck handling and repositioning of man and materials safely..
I'll teach them how to increase sortie generation rates and to maximize effectiveness in aircraft handling, flow and storage.
Those things are as much art as science and since it's not exactly trade secrets I don't helping fellow sailors out. From my experience, I've observed that the better trained the person is the more professional they become. Contrary to popular beliefs, It's the untrained or undertrained folks that are the most dangerous and unpredictable....
I'll even teach them how to shoot properly.
I hope they pay you enough for you to retire in the Bahama's because i don't think it will be a good idea for you to go back to the US after you have done that.
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