PLAN Aircraft Carrier programme...(Closed)

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Franklin

Captain
Before talking about 5 or 6 carriers China needs to build her first carrier. They could use the Liaoning hull design as a bases since China got both experience refitting the hull and also has the blue prints of the ship. But they need to make improvements over the current design.

1. enlarge hangar deck
2. enlarge aviation fuel tanks
3. catapults
4. engine testing rig
5. smaller island

They can achieve all this by rearranging the internal structure of the ship and some modifications on the hull, but of course mindful of the ships weight distrubution.
 

Scyth

Junior Member
What I'm curious is what strategy China is following for its armed forces and PLAN in particular. I don't think China will adopt the same strategy of power projection and intervention. So would it need ~10 carriers and another ~10 LHD/LPD like the USN? I mean the US is pursuing a very active policy of power projection and if needed intervention. Accordingly, they have many military bases around the world and have spread their fleet around the world with distinctive areas of operations.

The French with only 1 aircraft carrier is doing just fine. They were able to have a CBG ready for deployment during crises and both France and the UK were aiming for a 2 carrier fleet. I know they would love to have more carriers if the budget allowed it, but so would the US and many other countries.

Members already given the rule of thumb that 3 aircraft carriers would mean to have 1 available at any given time and to be sure 4 would be needed. I would settle with 3 and save the money for development of advanced submarines, which is still a weak area of China (both boomers and hunter-killers). The Liaoning is brand new, though of course somewhat challenged in capability (although calculations have been provided that J-15 can take-off with reasonable loads, it is still much depenent on weather conditions and the possiblity of operating AEW aircraft is also very limited). So these new aircraft carriers would ideally have to be 2 CATOBAR carriers. The result is that at any given time you'd have one aircraft carrier available though chances are that it'd be the "challenged" one, but that should not pose any problem if China is not aiming for the same strategy as the USN.

One problem with this is the transition of STOBAR to CATOBAR. Flight and deck crews will probably need to be recertified and trained for working with catapults and I'm not sure if it's safe to have a STOBAR crew work on a CATOBAR carrier and vice versa.
 

Franklin

Captain
Sanya, The New PLA Naval Carrier Base

20131129104756897.jpg

Are you kidding me? They just went out for 3 days and they pull into another port ?
 

kwaigonegin

Colonel
What I'm curious is what strategy China is following for its armed forces and PLAN in particular. I don't think China will adopt the same strategy of power projection and intervention. So would it need ~10 carriers and another ~10 LHD/LPD like the USN? I mean the US is pursuing a very active policy of power projection and if needed intervention. Accordingly, they have many military bases around the world and have spread their fleet around the world with distinctive areas of operations.

No PLAN definitely doesn't need 10 CSGs either soon or the forseeable future for the simple fact that they are not interested in the Atlantic domain. Their's is strictly Pacific only and as big as that pond is, you don't really need 10 CVBGs for that. 5 CSG is plenty to maintain power projection and maintain influence.
 

Franklin

Captain
I don't think this has been posted here yet. China's navy chief says that operational carrier still few years away.

China navy chief says operational aircraft carrier a few years away

The Chinese navy is using its first aircraft carrier, the Liaoning, for training and testing and will decide on an operational carrier for the fleet after a few years of evaluation, Admiral Wu Shengli said on Thursday.

The navy chief of the People's Liberation Army, on a military-to-military visit with his U.S. counterpart, told reporters at the Washington Navy Yard that Chinese sailors would carry out "very heavy" training over the next two or three years as they assess the carrier.


"After the training and experimentation we will have a final evaluation on the development of the aircraft carrier for the PLA navy," said Shengli, whose delegation included the commander of the Liaoning and the first pilot to land on its flight deck.

The Chinese carrier was built on the shell of a Soviet-era vessel that China purchased from Ukraine. China revamped the ship, which was formally commissioned in September 2012. Flight operations began two months later.

The launch of the first Chinese carrier is been seen as a symbol of Beijing's ambition for greater global influence and another sign of its rapid military buildup. U.S. officials have downplayed the importance, noting that it takes years to learn to effectively integrate carriers into fleet operations.

Senior Captain Zhang Zheng, the commander of the Liaoning, said the carrier was smaller than U.S. aircraft carriers and had a "ski jump"-style ramp at the end of its longest runway.

"We have around 36 airplanes operating on board our ship," he told reporters. "And we are still practicing and doing tests and experiments for the equipment and systems.
"

Wu, Zhang and Captain Dai Ming Meng, the pilot who first landed on the carrier, visited several American ships in California earlier this week, including the carrier USS Carl Vinson, where they met with their counterparts.

"We talked in great detail in San Diego with our aviation people and Admiral Wu's aviation people," said Admiral Jonathan Greenert, the U.S. Chief of Naval Operations, who hosted Wu. "It was great and inspiring to see two professionals talk about a common challenge - aviation from an aircraft carrier."

Wu received a ceremonial 19-gun salute at the Washington Navy Yard, the U.S. Navy's oldest shore establishment, during his formal welcoming ceremony on Thursday. He and his delegation visited the Pentagon later for further discussions.

The Wu visit was part of stepped-up efforts to improve military-to-military ties between the United States and China following a break in 2009 due to U.S. military sales to Taiwan. More than 40 visits, exchanges and engagements are planned for 2013, versus 20 last year.

China is due to participate for the first time next summer in the U.S.-sponsored Rim of the Pacific exercises, the world's largest maritime warfare exercise.

With the United States shifting its focus on the Asia-Pacific after a dozen years of war in Afghanistan, the two navies are increasingly bumping up against each other in hot spots in the region. They hope to build up a mutual understanding that can help avert confrontations in the future.

Greenert said recently that Wu and other Chinese military leaders want to "move on to a consistency of dialogue" and "get away from miscalculation."

"He has a challenge of a growing navy and an assignment ... to operate in the South China Sea," Greenert told the American Enterprise Institute think tank last week. "They know we're going to be there too ... so he wants to get away from miscalculation and preclude ... a scenario that they just wish they hadn't gotten themselves into."

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Blackstone

Brigadier
Well I think it will be a long time before China has 5-6 aircraft carriers if ever, more likely they will build two and have Liaoning as a 3rd for NSF, or if they are really ambitious they can build three new one for each fleet and retain Liaoning as a 4th for training

I also don’t think China will ever “forward deploy” a carrier strike group like USS George Washington CVN-73, unless on a war footing, by deployment I mean having a carrier deployed at any one time rotated in and out like in Gulf of Aden operations, for the last 5 years China has had 3 warships permanently deployed there but they are not forward deployed they rotate in and out on a permanent basis this is the likely deployment a Chinese carrier strike group will make along with an amphibious ready group, we can be sure China will have a carrier deployed at all times because otherwise the carrier air wings experience and training will fall to zero pretty fast if they are not doing carrier air wing training, having three carriers means they will need to keep one operational to maintain the skills to operate all three

China has plans for Indian Ocean, its one area which is the most likely to see permanent presence and if China wants to cover Indian Ocean they can do so by covering all three axis, North (Gwader) South (Seychelles) and West (East African country) and the East covered by China itself each foreign port will have a contain a Flotilla made up of an replenishment tanker, 1 DDG and 2 FFG so that’s 12 warships deployed overseas

The CVBG and ARG will not doubt use these ports as rest and replenishment stops, for repairs, maintenance and much needed spare parts as these kinds of naval groups are not easy to maintain far away they need a friendly port for stops with extensive facility’s for when things go wrong

So in conclusion I would say 1 CVBG and 1 ARG deployed at any one time, that’s not forward deployed that’s on rotation

2-3 overseas permanent naval bases with a Flotilla of warships in each

The total PLAN deployment around the world will then likely be between 18-24 warships which is a hell of a deployment

With advances in fracking, the US will be self-sufficient in energy in a decade or two. When that happens, it's not unreasonable for the US to lighten her footprint in the Middle East and rotate the air, naval, and Marine assets to the Western Pacific. In roughly the same time period, China will surpass the US as the largest economy in the world (by constant dollars in GDP), and she might forward deploy a CBG in the Middle East by 2030 or so.
 

kwaigonegin

Colonel
With advances in fracking, the US will be self-sufficient in energy in a decade or two. When that happens, it's not unreasonable for the US to lighten her footprint in the Middle East and rotate the air, naval, and Marine assets to the Western Pacific. In roughly the same time period, China will surpass the US as the largest economy in the world (by constant dollars in GDP), and she might forward deploy a CBG in the Middle East by 2030 or so.

Couple of things.. Yes oil does play a significant role however the reason why the US has concentrated efforts in the ME has a lot to do with 9/11 (Al Queda) and our close ties to Israel, Jordan, SA etc. Those things will remain pretty much the same regardless of energy independence of the United States.

While the war in Iran and Afghanistan is tapering down, majority of those forces are land forces. Naval assets will for the most part remain relatively the same or just very minor reduction in that region. Military warplanners are very aware of the still constant instability in the ME and the recent crisis in Syria to not make any drastic reduction or move any significant naval or air assets from that region anytime soon or even in the near future. IMHO if POTUS, Pentagon etc moving any air and naval forces away from the ME would be a very idiotic move unless we totally want to wash our hands off that region altogether which is not realistic.

As to forward deploy CSGs you need a relatively large base with the proper facilities, maintenance the whole she bang and until China has such a facility a fwd deployed CSG in the mid east would not practical. I may be wrong but I don't think PLAN has anything like that or even similar to say NSA Bahrain, Doha, Kuwait Navy Base / Camp Patriot, Camp Lemonnier etc. Basically to be have a permanent fwd deployed group you need a rather large port, an accompanying airfiled and prefably a Marine base or two on it or at least relatively close by within a couple hundred miles and obviously a local population that is relatively 'friendly' to your forces.

Of course with all that being said with the amount of economic dependencies and transactions that China has with Africa it is not unreasonable for them to lease land etc, share naval bases or start constructing a major naval base on that continent sometime in the future but that's all more political maneuvering than actual military.
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
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"We have around 36 airplanes operating on board our ship," he told reporters. "And we are still practicing and doing tests and experiments for the equipment and systems."

Should this read we will have 36 aircaft..? Ok if they have 36 aircraft that is most certainly something I want to see!!

Wu, Zhang and Captain Dai Ming Meng, the pilot who first landed on the carrier, visited several American ships in California earlier this week, including the carrier USS Carl Vinson, where they met with their counterparts.

"We talked in great detail in San Diego with our aviation people and Admiral Wu's aviation people," said Admiral Jonathan Greenert, the U.S. Chief of Naval Operations, who hosted Wu. "It was great and inspiring to see two professionals talk about a common challenge - aviation from an aircraft carrier."

Wu received a ceremonial 19-gun salute at the Washington Navy Yard, the U.S. Navy's oldest shore establishment, during his formal welcoming ceremony on Thursday. He and his delegation visited the Pentagon later for further discussions.

The Wu visit was part of stepped-up efforts to improve military-to-military ties between the United States and China following a break in 2009 due to U.S. military sales to Taiwan. More than 40 visits, exchanges and engagements are planned for 2013, versus 20 last year.

This ^^^ I really like! I hope peace breaks out in the Pacific!
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
First things were moving too slow now they are moving too fast although I don't think anything can be too fast for PLAN interested people!

Anyhow things are moving fast fast fast and it's getting better as time goes on

Imagine Liaoning broke cover with a full air wing!!!! Lol
 
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