PLAN Aircraft Carrier programme...(Closed)

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xiabonan

Junior Member
In a press briefing on 27th Nov, when asked about Liaoning's trip to South China Sea, the MoD spokesperson mentioned that the Sanya military port is now in 'preliminary condition' to harbour the Liaoning.

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Also, below is an image taken recently at the Sanya port. According to a thread on CJDBY that's two 093s and one 094 down there. There's a likelihood that they may join the Liaoning group for training when they arrive at South China Sea.

QQ图片20131128213704.jpg
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
According to spokesman of Taiwan DoD, the carrier formation entered Taiwan ADIZ since 10:30 (zulu+8), Nov 27 and left Taiwan ADIZ around 4:00, Nov 28. The carrier maintained her course around 14 nm distance from the center line of Taiwan strait.

This is the ROC version of CV-16 transit.

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Taipei, Nov. 28 (CNA) China's Liaoning aircraft carrier battle group did not cross the centerline of the Taiwan Strait when it passed through the waters on its way to the South China Sea, a Defense Ministry official said Thursday.

MND spokesman Maj. Gen. Luo Shuo-he said the military stayed fully abreast of the situation during the entire period that the Chinese fleet was passing through the strait that separates Taiwan from China.

"Our warplanes and warships kept close tabs on the Chinese fleet's passage through the Taiwan Strait," Luo said in an interview with CNA.

Citing military intelligence, Luo said the Liaoning battle group entered Taiwan's air defense identification zone (ADIZ) at 10:30 am Wednesday and sailed south in waters some 14 nautical miles west of the Taiwan Strait centerline.

"None of the warships in the mainland Chinese fleet trespassed across the centerline of the strait throughout the period," Luo said.

Besides keeping a close eye on the movement of the fleet, Luo said the military took necessary measures in accodance with standard operating procedures and relevant regulations. He did not elaborate.

China's official Xinhua news agency said earlier in the day that the Liaoning battle group had passed through the Taiwan Strait and entered the South China Sea.

The battle group, which includes two destroyers and two frigates in addition to China's only aircraft carrier, departed Qindao early Wednesday for a training mission, according to a previous Xinhua report.

This marks the sole Chinese aircraft carrier's first long-distance training and testing voyage, according to the report.

The exercise comes at a sensitive time, with the regional situation strained by China's Nov. 23 announcement of its demarcation of an East China Sea ADIZ that covers the disputed Diaoyutai Islands.

The uninhabited island cluster, which lies some 100 nautical miles northeast of Taiwan, has been under Japan's administrative control since 1972, but is also claim by Taiwan and China.
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
In the future if China establishes a carrier for each of its fleet plus the Liaoning as a fourth training carrier it would mean China can have a one carrier deployed at anyone time on a long range deployment

It also means one more can be activated on short notice for regional deployments

This should also be true for a large LHD, one for each fleet which means one on deployment at anyone time

So overall China should have one carrier and one LHD deployed around the world at anyone time, that's two flat tops that would be a good force
 

escobar

Brigadier
The captain of the aircraft carrier explains the objectives of this mission:

- assess the capacity of the equipments in a long distance mission and in a trans-regional assignment,
- evaluate the level of training of the different units constituting the group,
- assess the impact of meteorological and hydrological conditions on-board equipments.

[video=youtube;8aVHMQ80QBc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8aVHMQ80QBc[/video]
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
I'd like to see a final fleet of five carriers, tops, possibly reduced to four in future.

This is mostly in recognition that the first two or three of those carriers will be relatively "mid sized" carriers rather than full 100k ton CATOBAR nuclear powered monsters.

We already have liaoning, we expect a follow on class to be either 001A or 002, that is to say, either STOBAR or CATOBAR, but displacing similar to liaoning. either one 001A and one 002 will be built, or two 002s (if they decide to skip 001A), before they move onto CVN I imagine.

By the time two CVNs are built, I imagine they will be able to quite happily operate a 5 carrier fleet for about a decade until liaoning needs to be retired, necessitating the construction of a newer CVN class I imagine.


In any case, 4-5 carriers is a must have for the PLAN. 1 forward deployed in a CSG, two or three operating in home waters, and one that will be inevitably in refit/maintenance.



The same goes for the amphibious force.
I'd like to see ultimately 9 large LPDs akin to 071, but 6 would also be acceptable in the near term. 3-4 large LHDs in the 30-40k ton range is also necessary. Have 1 LHD and 2-3 LPDs forward deployed at any one time with a couple of their own escorts, and the PLAMC equivalent of an MEU dispersed among that force.

Of course, forward deploying a CVBG and an ARG will be a massive undertaking.
Each CVBG/ARG will need at least four escorts, possibly six, and possibly two AORs each, depending on how long they will deploy for. And also they'll need at least one SSN for each CVBG or ARG too.


That will be a massive challenge for both the country to build, but also for the PLAN's logistics and planning capacity.

I expect by 2030 China will have enough modern surface combatants to competently escort a CVBG and ARG abroad while also having enough ships back home as well.
If we consider a 3 DDG/CG and 3 FFG escort for each CVBG and ARG, they will have more than enough by 2030. They could hypothetically do so in a few years (say 2015) once they have 6 052C and 4 052D in service. They already have 20 054As in the water and all will be commissioned within a few years too.
That will leave 4 modern DDGs and 7 modern FFGs at home, in addition to the non 052C/D destroyers and older jiangweis, jianghus and 056s.


By 2020 we can expect all 8 052Ds to be in service too, with possibly 1-2 055s, and perhaps even a new generation frigate. And in 2030 I expect we'll see 055s replace all the older 051s, 052s, 051B, and possibly even sovremenny and 052B. They might even seek to expand the number of destroyer flotillas too.
In the meanwhile a new generation frigate will probably replace jiangweis and some jianghus on a one to one basis to maintain ship number, and will probably enter service in the main destroyer flotillas, while the older two 054s and older 054As are relegated to frigate patrol squadrons that currently are made up of jianghus and jiangweis.

All in all, if funding keeps up, chances are the PLAN will at least seek to maintain ship numbers. We've seen 056s effectively replacing 037s on one to one, there's no reason to expect new frigates and destroyers won't do the same.


The PLAN is already one of the largest and most capable navies even with two thirds to a half of its surface combatant fleet being elderly and near obsolete. Once they turn the entire force into a fleet equipped with modern cruisers, destroyers and frigates of the 21st century that can escort a modest number of large carriers and amphibious assault ships, they will be quite a force to be reckoned with.

Certainly they'll be beyond the class of european navies whose once might fleets have been reduced to only fielding a half dozen or so of modern DDG classes :(
 

LesAdieux

Junior Member
CV-16 docked at the new Sanya port on 29th, xinhua reports

it seems the cv-16 got two home-port, one in the north, one in the south. it likely to spend the winter in the south:D
 

A.Man

Major
A Trainer for PLA Navy

d0mk.jpg


Sanya, The New PLA Naval Carrier Base

20131129104756897.jpg
 
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asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Of course, forward deploying a CVBG and an ARG will be a massive undertaking.
Each CVBG/ARG will need at least four escorts, possibly six, and possibly two AORs each, depending on how long they will deploy for. And also they'll need at least one SSN for each CVBG or ARG too.


:(

Well I think it will be a long time before China has 5-6 aircraft carriers if ever, more likely they will build two and have Liaoning as a 3rd for NSF, or if they are really ambitious they can build three new one for each fleet and retain Liaoning as a 4th for training

I also don’t think China will ever “forward deploy” a carrier strike group like USS George Washington CVN-73, unless on a war footing, by deployment I mean having a carrier deployed at any one time rotated in and out like in Gulf of Aden operations, for the last 5 years China has had 3 warships permanently deployed there but they are not forward deployed they rotate in and out on a permanent basis this is the likely deployment a Chinese carrier strike group will make along with an amphibious ready group, we can be sure China will have a carrier deployed at all times because otherwise the carrier air wings experience and training will fall to zero pretty fast if they are not doing carrier air wing training, having three carriers means they will need to keep one operational to maintain the skills to operate all three

China has plans for Indian Ocean, its one area which is the most likely to see permanent presence and if China wants to cover Indian Ocean they can do so by covering all three axis, North (Gwader) South (Seychelles) and West (East African country) and the East covered by China itself each foreign port will have a contain a Flotilla made up of an replenishment tanker, 1 DDG and 2 FFG so that’s 12 warships deployed overseas

The CVBG and ARG will not doubt use these ports as rest and replenishment stops, for repairs, maintenance and much needed spare parts as these kinds of naval groups are not easy to maintain far away they need a friendly port for stops with extensive facility’s for when things go wrong

So in conclusion I would say 1 CVBG and 1 ARG deployed at any one time, that’s not forward deployed that’s on rotation

2-3 overseas permanent naval bases with a Flotilla of warships in each

The total PLAN deployment around the world will then likely be between 18-24 warships which is a hell of a deployment
 

delft

Brigadier
It is clear and understandable that PLAN follows many of the methods that have proven their value in USN. But the political and military tasks of PLAN are different from those of USN, now while USN is so much larger and and US is the hegemon, but also when in the future PLAN might be the largest navy in the world that world will certainly be very different in many other respects too. PLAN therefore should not build 100k nuclear aircraft carriers because that is now optimal for USN but it must build the carriers that are optimal for its tasks. I expect that will mean more carriers of somewhat smaller size. I also think that PLAN might have to build more than three carriers before they decide on the optimal configuration.
 
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