New Energy Vehicles (NEVs) in China

Topazchen

Junior Member
Registered Member
That's why GDP is such a worthless measure - it equates what a lawyer does with what a machinist does. Worse, it values the lawyer far more highly than the machinist. At least it serves one useful purpose: Letting the US think it's "richer" as China drains what's left of its vitality away.
It also takes into account overpriced healthcare which to me doesn't make sense. 80,000 usd procedures and
1,200 usd anti-biotics that elsewhere cost 1000 usd and 5 usd respectively are used to calculate the GDP.
Smh
 

supercat

Major
ICE cars still have strong following. Toyota Off-roaders are very popular.
easy to install extra fuel tank for long range.
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You still need very strong ICE industry especially diesel for transport, farming, construction and military vehicles.
EV will be twice as heavy if make them body on frame with much reduce range with all terrain tires
than there issue with dealing with extreme hot and cold weather performance and ground clearance. there are videos of Tesla Model Y tests at 110 F and its range already reduced 30% and that at flat road at optimum speed and no offroad tires.

This $20K lada has 3 diff locks. i doubt in such short vehicle a big battery can be installed.
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I think the future heavy commercial vehicle industry will be dominated by FCEVs that use hydrogen power, not necessarily ICE and diesel engines. I'm not sure body-on-frame chassis is even needed for modern SUVs (current generation of the legendary 4x4 off-road SUVs, Range Rover and Land Rover Defender, are unibody), especially with the prevalence of the integrated die-casting production process in the future. This combines with the CTP (Cell-to-Pack), or structural battery technology, will make future electric SUV/light truck considerably lighter. In fact, we already have quite a few electric SUV/light trucks in the pipeline currently, such as BYD's upscale SUV (which looks like a Land Rover Defender) for its future premier brand, the Rivian SUV and truck, Tesla Cybertruck, GMC Hummer electric SUV and truck, and the Ford F-150 electric truck.

VW using CN Gotion tech for its first battery factory.
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Today's evidence that the "Uyghur law" won't work.

The West has just waken up to the fact that Chinese EV makers are Tesla's strongest contenders now, which was unimaginable even 1 year ago. The scale and speed of the development of EV technologies in China are really explosive in the past year.

BYD, Chinese EV Rivals Turning Into Tesla’s Toughest Competition​

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tphuang

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CATL raising prices on Tesla and that's going into affect in Q3. Keep in mind that Tesla had raised prices in June across the board (almost) and battery prices are going up now. The Tesla Model 3 standard range version really must be seeing weak demand in China, since it was one of the few obvious versions that did not see raised prices.

Look at that, CATL out supplies LG by 5 to 1 to Tesla.

Even ambassador Qin Qang is promoting the increased number of EVs in China. Keep this up and start exporting abroad to environmentally conscious countries. It will be very good PR for China. I listened to an Aussie youtube clip today on byd and everyone was excited about it.

Again, auto industry is so important to a country's economic growth. China has stepped in to protect its domestic industry because COVID lock downs hurt it so much. I cannot stress how important it is for BYD to be building in 2nd/3rd/4th tiers cities. It will support a lot of the local economy in these places that did not have auto industry before.

China is dominating Thai EV market with expected 80% market share. Keep in mind that's probably a low base compared to ICE market.
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Thailand is aggressivly courting China investment in Eastern Economic Corridor for EVs.
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The Eastern Economic Corridor (EEC) is ready for investment in industries Chinese companies specialise in, such as electric cars and the agro-industry, the spokesman quoted the PM as saying.
 

Andy1974

Senior Member
Registered Member
ICE cars still have strong following. Toyota Off-roaders are very popular.
easy to install extra fuel tank for long range.
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You still need very strong ICE industry especially diesel for transport, farming, construction and military vehicles.
EV will be twice as heavy if make them body on frame with much reduce range with all terrain tires
than there issue with dealing with extreme hot and cold weather performance and ground clearance. there are videos of Tesla Model Y tests at 110 F and its range already reduced 30% and that at flat road at optimum speed and no offroad tires.

This $20K lada has 3 diff locks. i doubt in such short vehicle a big battery can be installed.
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I am looking forward to the day that China dominates ICE cars also, after all everyone is stopping developing them but there is still a big need for them. China will be doing more R&D into ICE‘s than anyone else.
 

Tam

Brigadier
Registered Member
But ICE cars are not robust, reliable or rugged.

However, these are inherent characteristics of electric cars which are just batteries plus a motor.

You could even argue that electric cars (even with all the electronics) are actually simpler than ICE cars which have thousands of complex mechanical components.

And the lack of infotainment system and app store will be a deal breaker for car buyers

ICE vehicles, especially pickups, are often rugged enough that they are used for warfare. Many modern low intensity conflicts can be referred to as pickup wars. That alone there is a defense angle for the Russian vehicular industry.

I am talking about vehicles that are developed for the Third World. A poor farmer delivering his goods from his farm to the wet market doesn't need an infotainment center or apps. He just needs a cheap, rugged and reliable vehicle. Even in vehicles with infotainment centers, I often see people don't use the infotainment centers, and you will likely find more technologically adverse and simple people in the rurals of emerging nations.

There is a question whether electronics can endure long term being under extreme heat or cold. Try putting your smartphone inside a car under a parking lot in hot sunshine continually and see how long it can last.

In rural areas --- not talking about China where there is a rural village called for good reason, the Tesla village, aka highest concentration of Teslas per capita on Earth --- there is an absence of recharging stations. Many poor countries also lack renewable power sources, solar, wind, hydro, although there are ongoing projects, often Chinese financed. So whatever power comes out from the grid, still comes from carbon fuel.

Then there is the cost. In Venezuela, the cost of gasoline is 12 cents a gallon. In Russia, its only $2.10 and I bet a good part comes from taxes. In Malaysia its only $1.74. In Egypt its $1.96. In Libya its only 12 cents. In Iran its 36 cents per liter. In countries like these, there is little economic incentive to leave ICE.

People still underestimate what the Russia automotive industry can do.

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uavpatriot.jpg
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
No no no see here BYD is actually an American owned company, that's why they're doing so well.

View attachment 92274
the copium is strong

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214,956,757 18.5%
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132,133,663 11.3%
China Investment Corp. (Investment Management) 20,873,400 1.79%
First Seafront Fund Management Co., Ltd. 20,672,372 1.77%
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18,299,740 1.57%
China Universal Asset Management Co., Ltd. 15,477,648 1.33%
GF Fund Management Co., Ltd. 12,276,344 1.05%
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11,702,533 1.00%
Fullgoal Fund Management Co., Ltd. 11,146,123 0.96%
China Asset Management Co., Ltd. 10,375,002 0.89%

Berkshire Hathaway only owns the Hong Kong shell company used for trading.

The operational unit of BYD in Shenzhen is owned by Wang Chuanfu and Lv Xiangyang.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
But ICE cars are not robust, reliable or rugged.

However, these are inherent characteristics of electric cars which are just batteries plus a motor.

You could even argue that electric cars (even with all the electronics) are actually simpler than ICE cars which have thousands of complex mechanical components.

And the lack of infotainment system and app store will be a deal breaker for car buyers
an electric car is actually battery and motor... plus high current AC-DC converters, DC-DC voltage converters, battery management chips, charging management chips, steering/brake/accelerator A-D converters and capacitors.

That's just to drive, steer, start, stop and fuel the car like an ICE car. It is very semiconductor heavy.
 

Chish

Junior Member
Registered Member
the copium is strong

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214,956,757 18.5%
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132,133,663 11.3%
China Investment Corp. (Investment Management) 20,873,400 1.79%
First Seafront Fund Management Co., Ltd. 20,672,372 1.77%
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18,299,740 1.57%
China Universal Asset Management Co., Ltd. 15,477,648 1.33%
GF Fund Management Co., Ltd. 12,276,344 1.05%
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11,702,533 1.00%
Fullgoal Fund Management Co., Ltd. 11,146,123 0.96%
China Asset Management Co., Ltd. 10,375,002 0.89%

Berkshire Hathaway only owns the Hong Kong shell company used for trading.

The operational unit of BYD in Shenzhen is owned by Wang Chuanfu and Lv Xiangyang.
Majority shareholders are Americans while under complete Chinese management. Check out the shareholders section.
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Last edited:

Blitzo

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Majority shareholders are Americans while under complete Chinese management. Check out the shareholders section.
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He was comparing the shareholders section, but looking at the CNE100001526 vs CNE100000296, the latter being the one with foreign shareholders (listed in HK).

I don't understand where that reddit comment got the "60% of company owned by americans part" -- even for the foreign shareholders for the HK listing, the total equity held is only 35.23%
 

pmc

Major
Registered Member
Yet, BYD is creating an EV version of off-roader. Clearly, it is not a category confined to ICE cars.
key word is creating. . All those EV vehicles have long wheel base, wide track that make it hard to maneuver. battery size define the power and weight. with no data on long term reliability of suspension and tire life. certainly alot of semi-conductor needed to control the wheel spin.

There are all kind of product for that now with BEVs and hydrogen fuel cells. trucks, forklift, tractors, garbage trucks, everything is getting electrified in China.
CAT American firm has turnover of more than $50b. Komatsu is $20b. than you add various military, transport and farm equipment maker. It very substantial market on global scale. EV are more suitable for city bus or local truck delivery. They are not long range multi-wheeler that can travel thousand miles a day.
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military is a different story.

technology is improving. I wouldn't be using Tesla as the industry leading technology barometer.
Tesla atleast range wise is good enough indicator for an CUV considering the size.
 
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