Indian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

Stealthflanker said:

Turkey already demonstrate Kaan, South Korea is about to serialize KF-21

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mossen said:

In my humble opinion, if the engine on your 5th gen isn't your own then you don't really have a jet that you can call fully your own. By this admittedly strict definition, only the US and China have 5th gen aircraft.

I think India has long suffered from a "leapfrog" mentality where they never bother mastering the basics and just want to jump to the edge of the innovation frontier right away. The long slog of doing the fundamentals may not be as sexy, but it is crucial to actually getting the hardest parts right. So reading about them trying to go for 5th gen before they even have their own engine for their 4th gen is a bit tiresome. We've seen this movie before.

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Biscuits said:

So India does not view China as bordering it?

Isn't it concerning that someone so high up would say something that is objectively non factual? What is the exact quote, I can't help to think something was lost in translation, such as them only saying that China doesn't have a strategically threatening border with India, which would be a smart stance to take in order to focus on local/internal Indian military actions, rather than risking the provocation of overwhelming forces from the north.

But the way you've rendered the translation makes it look like ostrich mentality, I mean outright denying the existence of a border with China isn't a good look.

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siegecrossbow said:

OG video. 9:45 mark.

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ACuriousPLAFan said:

So a country that has zero (yes, ZERO) 5th-gen fighters is claiming that none of its neighbors posses 5th-gen fighter jets - While the other country that has been operating not one - But TWO models of 5th-gen fighters since the mid-2000s

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.

But yeah, your IAF chief is definitely correct. Totally. Jai Hind!

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Biscuits said:

So India does not view China as bordering it?

Isn't it concerning that someone so high up would say something that is objectively non factual? What is the exact quote, I can't help to think something was lost in translation, such as them only saying that China doesn't have a strategically threatening border with India, which would be a smart stance to take in order to focus on local/internal Indian military actions, rather than risking the provocation of overwhelming forces from the north.

But the way you've rendered the translation makes it look like ostrich mentality, I mean outright denying the existence of a border with China isn't a good look.

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PiSigma said:

I totally agree, by Chinese counting standards, J20 is 4th gen.

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Stealthflanker said:

Well. India so far is currently the only one having stealth fighter program which has not yet to demonstrate flying prototypes. Russia already moved on to serialize Su-57, China already have a large fleet of J-20 and in process of having naval J-35, Turkey already demonstrate Kaan, South Korea is about to serialize KF-21 (well this one might not be all that stealthty but clean condition.. i would say it can get to 0.3 sqm or less).

They probably need a harsh wake up call to finally get their stuff together.

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mossen said:

In my humble opinion, if the engine on your 5th gen isn't your own then you don't really have a jet that you can call fully your own. By this admittedly strict definition, only the US and China have 5th gen aircraft.

I think India has long suffered from a "leapfrog" mentality where they never bother mastering the basics and just want to jump to the edge of the innovation frontier right away. The long slog of doing the fundamentals may not be as sexy, but it is crucial to actually getting the hardest parts right. So reading about them trying to go for 5th gen before they even have their own engine for their 4th gen is a bit tiresome. We've seen this movie before.

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Pataliputra said:

To be classified as a 5th generation fighter jet, specific criteria must be met. If these standards are not fulfilled, it is more practical to opt for a 4th generation jet. The Indian Air Force's preference for the costly Rafales over the more economical Su-57 is rooted in the prioritization of winning wars rather than showcasing fighter jets. For a fighter jet to be considered 5th generation, stealth capabilities are crucial. the Indian TEDBF, despite incorporating stealth geometry, is still categorized as a 4.5 generation fighter jet.
View attachment 123823
Notably, the Tejas, a 4th generation fighter, has a relatively low radar cross-section of 0.5 square meters.

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Pataliputra said:

To be classified as a 5th generation fighter jet, specific criteria must be met. If these standards are not fulfilled, it is more practical to opt for a 4th generation jet. The Indian Air Force's preference for the costly Rafales over the more economical Su-57 is rooted in the prioritization of winning wars rather than showcasing fighter jets. For a fighter jet to be considered 5th generation, stealth capabilities are crucial. the Indian TEDBF, despite incorporating stealth geometry, is still categorized as a 4.5 generation fighter jet.
View attachment 123823
Notably, the Tejas, a 4th generation fighter, has a relatively low radar cross-section of 0.5 square meters.

Click to expand...

Pataliputra said:

To be classified as a 5th generation fighter jet, specific criteria must be met. If these standards are not fulfilled, it is more practical to opt for a 4th generation jet. The Indian Air Force's preference for the costly Rafales over the more economical Su-57 is rooted in the prioritization of winning wars rather than showcasing fighter jets. For a fighter jet to be considered 5th generation, stealth capabilities are crucial. the Indian TEDBF, despite incorporating stealth geometry, is still categorized as a 4.5 generation fighter jet.
View attachment 123823
Notably, the Tejas, a 4th generation fighter, has a relatively low radar cross-section of 0.5 square meters.

Click to expand...

Biscuits said:

That has nothing to do with my question of some Indian official supposedly being in denial that his country shares a border with China...? So idk why you quote me back without saying anything.

Anyways the Rafale thing was borne out of a (imho extremely questionable) need to have a fighter NOW. Even at the cost of not getting the Su57s, since Russia can't deliver them on a timely manner. Having to pay so much for them is objectively a L, but India simply had no choice. They don't have the ability to design their own 4.5gen, no one else would sell to them. So the French can price gouge the shit out of India.

The Rafale was needed to keep up with Pakistan, but it doesn't help at all against China, which has even begun to scale back on producing aircraft that are similar in performance to the Rafale, aircraft which are fully and easily manufactured en masse locally, at volumes even the French can't make for their own airforce.

Until India can manufacture by itself planes, missiles, engines comparable with J10/Rafale, India can not try to even begin to compete with China. If they're being realistic, they should focus on competing with Pakistan.

So I'm not disagreeing on avoiding overt competition, I'm just questioning if straight up denying the existence of a border is the smart thing to do by a senior official...

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pevade said:

We'll count it as a 4.5 gen if it ever becomes reality. As far as everyone is concerned, the TEDBF is nothing more than fancy CG.

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Pataliputra said:

No Indian military official refuted the substantial and evident border that India shares with China. The Chief of the Indian Air Force stated that the Chinese J-20 is not a 5th generation fighter jet, indicating that there is no urgent need for a 5th generation fighter jet for the Indian Air Force. The suggestion is that the IAF can patiently await the development of the Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA).

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