COMAC C929 Widebody Airliner

sunnymaxi

Major
Registered Member
the Slon next generation transporter aka PAK-VTA. But the Russian Defense Ministry seems to want an 28 ton engine for the An-124 and to resume its production
i always wanted to know. why Russia started new project like PAK-VTA for heavy strategic airlifter when AN-124 is available. its better to invest in AN-124 existing supply chain and this aircraft is big enough to fulfil all domestic/Military demands.
 

weig2000

Captain
The Russians have other priorities, but they are still spending quite a lot on this program and related widebody aircraft activities.

The Russians are currently flight testing the Il-96-400M widebody. And while most of the technology used in that aircraft already existed, like the basic airframe design and the PS-90A1 engines, they designed a whole new glass cockpit for it. I wouldn't be surprised if the avionics were new.

CIAM finished bench testing the PD-35 gas generator recently:
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The Russian government will then have to make a decision on the size of the engine to be initially produced based on this technology. It remains to be seen if this will be a 35 ton engine, or a 28 ton engine, or some other power rating. The Russian aviation industry probably wants the 35 ton engine so it can be used on the civilian widebody aircraft, an Il-96 with a new wing and two engines, and the Slon next generation transporter aka PAK-VTA. But the Russian Defense Ministry seems to want an 28 ton engine for the An-124 and to resume its production. If they pick the 28 ton engine, then the 35 ton engine project will probably be delayed past 2030 and won't be available as an option for the C-929.

The Russians are still doing massive spending on the civilian transportation sector. If anything the sanctions only accelerated the spending. Because for a country as large as Russia, with little high speed rail, they need the long haul aircraft.

Sure, longer-range, wide-body aircraft such as IL-96-400M is more important for Russia than C929 is for China.
 

Atomicfrog

Major
Registered Member
i always wanted to know. why Russia started new project like PAK-VTA for heavy strategic airlifter when AN-124 is available. its better to invest in AN-124 existing supply chain and this aircraft is big enough to fulfil all domestic/Military demands.
Antonov is still Ukrainian... so building more is kinda weird. Some have been build at CJSC Aviastar but I don't know if it's from scratch or major components were still shipped from Ukraine beside the engine that are now problematic. CJSC Aviastar build also the IL-76/TU-204, don't know how much space is left to accomodate another type presently.

For the civilian market, the C929 is probably in the wish list of Russian airlines. Even if IL-96-400M is more important for Russia, I'm not sure they will be able to have enough production for their needs.
 
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quim

Junior Member
Registered Member
The Il-96-400M will only be used mainly for cargo transportation and should be produced in sufficient numbers to meet this need.

About the C929, Russia should only want it on its list if there is a Russified version with PD-35 engines and avionics and others sanctions-proof Russian or Chinese components. Because the US will never allow China to export planes with Western components to Russia without authorization.

For passenger transport, Russia already has enough Boeings and Airbuses in operation and a number of new traditional Il-96s will be produced until 2030 whena news widebody needs arrive.
 
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quim

Junior Member
Registered Member
As Russia is still a supplier, its role still deserves to be discussed in the present and in the future of the C929, obviously, as well as the US and UK, which will be China's main suppliers.

Also, Russia's experience dealing with these Western countries in its past projects is worth discussing and it would be very negligent for any interested party not to take this into consideration.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Are there any news on the Western engine option for the C-929? This was supposed to be the initial engine for the aircraft that would be used until the CJ-2000 and PD-35 were ready. I heard rumors that Rolls-Royce might be the supplier at one point, but then nothing concrete.

For example there is this article:
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But it seems speculative to me. For one it claims the CJ-2000 was being developed with Ukrainian help. But I never heard of that being the case.
 

quim

Junior Member
Registered Member
Airliner business is like long marathon instead of a sprint, so China is probably hedging for Post Ukraine war as well as post Putin Russia. It is a sane policy for China to keep door open for West as well as Russia but seek steady independent development.
I think the only open door to the West that the US accepts is if China subjects COMAC to being just like an Embraer or a Bombardier, completely subject to US policy and dependent of Western technology forever.

If Putin fails in Ukraine or in his succession, Russia will return to the 1990s Yeltsin era of abandoning domestic technological projects and developments in favor of just buying Western technology and being happy with it. So China will be isolated and will become the next target to repeat this script.

The US foreign policy does not accept anything different from this. But I shouldn't prolong this subject to not bring politics into this thread.
 

sunnymaxi

Major
Registered Member
Are there any news on the Western engine option for the C-929? This was supposed to be the initial engine for the aircraft that would be used until the CJ-2000 and PD-35 were ready. I heard rumors that Rolls-Royce might be the supplier at one point, but then nothing concrete.
GEnx was in race as well. but Trent7000 has been finalized as the initial engines of C929. though agreement yet to be sign. next year most probably

C929 model displayed along with Trent7000 in Zhuhai air show last year.

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For example there is this article:
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But it seems speculative to me. For one it claims the CJ-2000 was being developed with Ukrainian help. But I never heard of that being the case.
bro this article is written by a Russian aviation expert. let me tell you, Russian aviation experts have very negative and outdated perception about Chinese aviation industry. they are as good as Western analyst.

from that article -

'China’s AECC had begun developing the CJ-2000 turbofan using Ukrainian technology and components, but the project now appears likely to go nowhere after the Russian air force destroyed the Motor-Sich aero-engine plant in Zaporizhzhia on May 26. An earlier plan for a close relationship between Chinese and Ukrainian aero-engine industries fell through after the government in Kyiv vetoed the sale of a major stake in Motor-Sich to Chinese investors.'

using Ukrainian technology and components.. LMAO

this happens, when you don't know anything but have to write the article.

The materials , components and advance manufacturing process are using in CJ-2000 is beyond Ukraine's thinking.
 
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