China won Turkey's missile defense competition

antiterror13

Brigadier
This deal is big but the biggest arms deal in Chinese history is the 50 DF-3 ballistic missiles that were sold to Saudi Arabia in 1986 estimated price tag was excess of $3 billion

IRBM bases were built in the desert one of them is the Al Sulayyail IRBM Missile base

Interesting .... I've never understood why Saudi bought it from China, and DF-3 is very early version of Chinese IRBM. America was surely able to offer much better missile at that time (1986-1987). And it come out of the blue, really

And also what is the purpose of buying IRBM and I understand it was over 2,500 km range. I thought the export limitation was something like 300 km range
 

chuck731

Banned Idiot
Interesting .... I've never understood why Saudi bought it from China, and DF-3 is very early version of Chinese IRBM. America was surely able to offer much better missile at that time (1986-1987). And it come out of the blue, really

And also what is the purpose of buying IRBM and I understand it was over 2,500 km range. I thought the export limitation was something like 300 km range

At the time China was the only power with IRBM capability that hadn't jointed the various weapon technology non-proliforation regimes, DF-3 was the only IRBM available on the open market. I believe this is also the only instance in world history when a country sold a indisputably strategic nuclear missile (albeit without a warhead) to anther country that hitherto had no strategic nuclear delivery capability.

BTW, there is no way in hell the Israeli lobby will permit the United States to sell to an Arab country a missile that could hit anywhere in Israel.
 
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This deal is big but the biggest arms deal in Chinese history is the 50 DF-3 ballistic missiles that were sold to Saudi Arabia in 1986 estimated price tag was excess of $3 billion

IRBM bases were built in the desert one of them is the Al Sulayyail IRBM Missile base

Wow, I am really surprised that this deal took place when it did because wasn't that the period when China was being cozy with the West and Israel in defence? Wouldn't this have put those relationships at risk? I guess the desire to be buddies was mutual enough, and as long as the missiles are meant to be pointed at Iran then it's okay enough for everyone.
 

antiterror13

Brigadier
Wow, I am really surprised that this deal took place when it did because wasn't that the period when China was being cozy with the West and Israel in defence? Wouldn't this have put those relationships at risk? I guess the desire to be buddies was mutual enough, and as long as the missiles are meant to be pointed at Iran then it's okay enough for everyone.

Interesting what was the purpose of the IRBM for Saudi ? Are the Chinese operators/technicians still there ? Do the missiles get upgraded over time ? what type of warhead fitted ?
 

chuck731

Banned Idiot
Interesting what was the purpose of the IRBM for Saudi ? Are the Chinese operators/technicians still there ? Do the missiles get upgraded over time ? what type of warhead fitted ?

Saudi purchased the missiles from china at the height of Iran Iraq war, when both Iran and Iraq acquired large stockpiles of short and medium range ballistic missiles to bombard eachother's cities. So it stands to reason these missiles were originally purchased to give Saudi Arabia potential leverage in the course of the war, deterrence against the war spreading to Saudi Arabia, and insurance against Iran should Iran win the war.

It seems to be generally accepted that not only do these missiles remain operational, but several additional support, storage and launch facilities had been built for them since the 2001 invasion of Iraq. These new launch site seem to be positioned to better strike at Iraq and Israel.

It's been rumored that the original cost of the transaction with china included a 30 years support contract. It is not clear if there are actual Chinese operator/technicians still there, but unless the Chinese reneged on the contract, china will be supporting these missiles in some way until 2017.

It has also been rumored three is agreement between Pakistan and Saudi arabia to mount Pakistani nuclear warheads on these missiles under certain circumstances. But whether that is practicable is not clear.

A few years ago it was said Saudis approached the Chinese to purchase the DF-21 to replace DF-3, but we're rebuffed. The main candidate to replace DF-3 is now the Pakistani hataf 4.
 

antiterror13

Brigadier
Saudi purchased the missiles from china at the height of Iran Iraq war, when both Iran and Iraq acquired large stockpiles of short and medium range ballistic missiles to bombard eachother's cities. So it stands to reason these missiles were originally purchased to give Saudi Arabia potential leverage in the course of the war, deterrence against the war spreading to Saudi Arabia, and insurance against Iran should Iran win the war.

It seems to be generally accepted that not only do these missiles remain operational, but several additional support, storage and launch facilities had been built for them since the 2001 invasion of Iraq. These new launch site seem to be positioned to better strike at Iraq and Israel.

It's been rumored that the original cost of the transaction with china included a 30 years support contract. It is not clear if there are actual Chinese operator/technicians still there, but unless the Chinese reneged on the contract, china will be supporting these missiles in some way until 2017.

It has also been rumored three is agreement between Pakistan and Saudi arabia to mount Pakistani nuclear warheads on these missiles under certain circumstances. But whether that is practicable is not clear.

A few years ago it was said Saudis approached the Chinese to purchase the DF-21 to replace DF-3, but we're rebuffed. The main candidate to replace DF-3 is now the Pakistani hataf 4.

China could sell DF-11/15 though ...

I highly doubt Pakistan has the technology to miniaturize nuke warhead to fit into any missile. Having able to develop a nuke (with the help from China) and able to deliver it with Ballistic Missile is a two different things
 

Hyperwarp

Captain
is HQ-9 uses TVM similiar to patriot? wikipedia claim HQ-9 are far more related to patriot than S-300.

According to
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, the HQ-9 uses TVM and Active RADAR for terminal guidance.

MIM-104F Patriot (PAC-3) also has a terminal active seeker. Its a 'ka' band seeker. Remember, unlike previous versions PAC3 is 'hit-to-kill'.
 

Dizasta1

Senior Member
I highly doubt Pakistan has the technology to miniaturize nuke warhead to fit into any missile. Having able to develop a nuke (with the help from China) and able to deliver it with Ballistic Missile is a two different things

Well not "any" missile, but Pakistan has successfuly managed to develop miniturized nuclear weapons.
 
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