TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
but they are aircraft. Its like arguing that a amphibious assault vehicle should be naval not in the army.
Z-20 (all variants) thread
- Thread starter delft
- Start date
Amphibious assault vehicles are still operated by the army, hence they're put under the army section. Whether or not to classify Z-10 as air force or army depends on whether the section titled "Air Force" denotes a specific branch in the military or denotes a type of equipment.
MwRYum
Major
If not for the USSR bite the dust in the 1991, the Chinese would be using more Blackhawks, because they find its "hot and high" environment performance very favourable. Acquiring Mi-17s was out of necessity mostly, because the Chinese simply lack a model in the 10-ton helicopter category, plus the "hot and high" operation requirement demanded for western China areas.
While the Mi-17 have "hot and high" option, there are saying that the Chinese ain't entirely satisfy with it.
As for this thread location, well you can be rest assured that if the Z-20 is very real deal (3 days on, still no hi-res pics "leaked") and enter into production, not only the army aviation will fly them, the air force and navy will do so as well, thus technically still fits in the "air force" area.
Skywatcher
Captain
Most probably, since that remark was in response to a question about the Z-20.
We still got the PLAN marines and they and their asset are totally under PLAN command.
for Contractors supporting allies and UN organizations in Afghanistan , they prefer the Mi-17 Hotandhigh versions. china has some similiar ones.
One problem is that Hip can't fit into the C-130/Y-9 cargo door.
but the primary problem with Hip is that it is not built by AVIC
, only assembled by army maintenance...
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superdog
Junior Member
Another thing is that the Mi-17 is not exactly in the same class as Z-20 or blackhawk, it is bigger, less maneuverable, and requires larger landing surfaces. Mi-17 is a more cost-effective solution to transport lots of stuff under more tolerable conditions (good landing area, normal altitude, not in extreme weather, etc.), but it may not fit the tactical needs in harsher environments. I think the PLA will continue to need both an economical workhorse like the Mi-17 and a high performance "front-line" medium lifter like the Z-20. In the long run they may use Z-18 to replace Mi-17 if they manage to lower its cost, or they may develop a twin engine 13-ton chopper, or they may even buy the Mi-38. The Z-20 fills a role that the PLA didn't have a perfect fit before, but I don't think it will work as a complete replacement for the Mi-17.for Contractors supporting allies and UN organizations in Afghanistan , they prefer the Mi-17 Hotandhigh versions. china has some similiar ones.
One problem is that Hip can't fit into the C-130/Y-9 cargo door.
but the primary problem with Hip is that it is not built by AVIC
Via CDF:
A pretty awesome video of an exercise during mission action 2013...
Involved 118 helicopters
Seemed to include Z-10, Z-8, Z-9W, and a hell of a lot of Mi-17s.
Despite the PLA's relatively small vertical lift to soldier ratio, its actual number of vertical lift assets is not that small, and should be among the top five in the world's armies.
Certainly putting over a hundred choppers up in one training exercise is pretty impressive imo, although obviously we don't know how scripted it was, how extensive it was, etc, and I'm not familiar with what constitutes a "large" western military air assault exercise either.
Once Z-20 production starts in earnest I'm sure the PLA ground forces will buy them up like dumplings... I wonder how many navalized Z-20s the navy will buy though, probably less than the army, given there are only so many ships to go around in the first place.
A pretty awesome video of an exercise during mission action 2013...
Involved 118 helicopters
Seemed to include Z-10, Z-8, Z-9W, and a hell of a lot of Mi-17s.
Despite the PLA's relatively small vertical lift to soldier ratio, its actual number of vertical lift assets is not that small, and should be among the top five in the world's armies.
Certainly putting over a hundred choppers up in one training exercise is pretty impressive imo, although obviously we don't know how scripted it was, how extensive it was, etc, and I'm not familiar with what constitutes a "large" western military air assault exercise either.
Once Z-20 production starts in earnest I'm sure the PLA ground forces will buy them up like dumplings... I wonder how many navalized Z-20s the navy will buy though, probably less than the army, given there are only so many ships to go around in the first place.
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
closest American equivalent to the Hip is probably the CH46 Seaknight, for the Europeans Merlin or Puma.
The Blackhawk is more of a intermediate bird sitting between a lightweight like the H-6 little bird and the medium S92 SuperHawk.
Z20 would likely similarly sit between Z9 and Z8. Max troop load is maybe a dozen not counting crew that would of they follow the Blackhawk standard pilot and copilot plus one or two gunners.
If Z20 is as capable as Blackhawk then the question is just how closely they will use the Blackhawk as the roadmap. Meaning roles to include transport, ASW, CSAR, medevac, special ops and battle hawk a special operations version packing a turreted chain gun and external arms. If they do follow close perhaps even a stealth version. But that's down the road some distance.
now this still leaves a capacity gap in heavy lift chopper class. Option one would be to procure a a true heavyweight like Mi26 option two procure a heavier medium lift and make due much like Chinook Which sits between hip and CH53.
Given the tilt rotor program the PLA has admitted to I suspect they may be looking to that to operate as there future heavyweight. The quad configuration seems to me suited to a platform roughly equivalent to the current American Chinook or maybe CH53E super stallion. I am not sure it could as we have seen though go near Mi26 class.
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