Z-10 thread

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Verum

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Can Pakistan afford such an expensive helicopter? Even "poor man's Apache", the Bell Viper costs about 30 million USD each and the real Apache costs about 40+. Judging from wikipedia and other publicly available info, WZ10 is probably on par in terms of performance and weight class as the new Viper.
Although WZ10 is produced in China, a country famous for cheap weapons, rising wages and inflations have made everything more expensive there. Plus since it was finalized within the last few years, it uses latest avionics, further adding to its overall cost. My personal conservative estimates for its cost would be about 20-25 million, then another 5 million on top for spare parts and maintenance. So each costs about 25 - 30 million.
Unlike fighter jets, which can be super effective with few sorties carrying precision weapons, attack helicopters have to be used en masse in order to be effective. So when Pakistan start buying them in bulk, they really have to buy a lot of them.
Pakistan currently has about 50 aging AH-1 Cobras, so they would need to buy at least equal numbers to replace current fleet then plus additional numbers to expand their capabilities.
Assuming only 50 will be purchased, that's 50 x 30 million, which is 1.5 billion USD.
Pakistan's annual defense budget is only about 7 billion. Although plausible, it is unlikely to be fielded in large numbers/
 

Blitzo

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@Verum, Z-10 is actually lighter than Viper.
Viper is in the 10 ton class equal to apache, while while Z-10 is more like 5-6 tons in the class of tiger.

That doesn't mean Z-10 will be cheap for Pakistan by any means but I wouldn't immediately go challenging the likelihood of Pakistan buying Z-10 seeing as we don't know how many they may want nor how much a Z-10 internationally costs. Then we have to factor in the likelihood of Chinese soft loans helping support a Pakistani purchase.


On another topic; can a mod please change the title of the thread to "Z-10" rather than "WZ-10"? The PLA does not use the WZ prefix for attack helicopters or in fact any kind of helicopter to my knowledge, and we should get our designations right.
 

Scratch

Captain
Just because it has been mentioned. I don't really see the reason of AHs being only effective when employed in large numbers. AHs carry PGMs as well with their ATGMs. Be it laser, MMW radar or wire guided. Plus, even medium sized AHs, when outfitting both stub-wing station with a quad pack launcher, carry eight missiles. That's eight precision weapons for individual targets per aircraft. Something most fixed wing jets struggle to get close to. Now, obviously jets carry much bigger weapons, wich will be a decisive factor for certain missions, but not for all.
Depending on the target, even two to four AHs may do quiet well were a two-ship of jets may have issues achieving the desired effect.
Of course helicopters won't normally be able to overfly even low-alt surface to air threats, but there other ways to get around those.
 

Black Shark

Junior Member
@Verum, Z-10 is actually lighter than Viper.
Viper is in the 10 ton class equal to apache, while while Z-10 is more like 5-6 tons in the class of tiger.

That doesn't mean Z-10 will be cheap for Pakistan by any means but I wouldn't immediately go challenging the likelihood of Pakistan buying Z-10 seeing as we don't know how many they may want nor how much a Z-10 internationally costs. Then we have to factor in the likelihood of Chinese soft loans helping support a Pakistani purchase.


On another topic; can a mod please change the title of the thread to "Z-10" rather than "WZ-10"? The PLA does not use the WZ prefix for attack helicopters or in fact any kind of helicopter to my knowledge, and we should get our designations right.

AH-1Z does not come even close to 10t class. It has a MTOW of 8410kg and only in fery range with big fuel tanks.

The Z-10 also reaches it 8t MTOW, however that will only grow when they get WZ-16 engines.
 

Blitzo

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Wikipedia puts AH-1Z's MTOW at 8.4 tons like black shark says, and most other places does put it similar.

Z-10 however is definitely lighter than 8 tons at the moment, and while we have no firm numbers I think the rumours of 5-6 ton MTOW looks about right given what the baseline output of WZ-9 can provide.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Wikipedia puts AH-1Z's MTOW at 8.4 tons like black shark says, and most other places does put it similar.
8.25 English Long tons is 9.25 US Short tons. I used Short tons. A Short ton is 2,000 pounds (907kg) a long ton is 2,240 pounds (1,016Kg)
 
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