Ukrainian War Developments
- Thread starter james smith esq
- Start date
- Status
That's what ultranationalists said when Ukraine declared independence from Soviet Union.
Soviet Union in 1989: "Ukraine, you declared independence from me because you are US-CIA Puppet!"
So basically anyone who refuses Russian-domination as part of it's sphere of influence (or literal colony) is a "puppet of West". Got it.
There is in Ukraine. How many NATO troops is too many for this "redline"?
Port Arthur (Dalian Port) was a strategically vital Russian naval base in China, giving Russia access to heart of East Asia.
Imagine if Russia said: "If those damn Ching-chong Boxers never was hostile to us mighty Whites, we would have no need to annex Port Arthur. Once those Ching-Chongs decided to antagonize us, we have no choice except to fully annex Port Arthur. It's "strategically vital warm-water port!" "
This is the ridiculous logic I cannot accept, as it can easily be applied to China if China ever becomes weak again (which I hope is never).
If only because Russia is weak, and Chinese 'pit the barbarians vs. barbarians' strategy. Not because China believes of any Russian farcical claims to "Ownership of Slavic peoples".
Last edited:
solarz
Brigadier
It's telling that you have to be deliberately disingenuous to defend your position here. Ukraine is a non-actor because it is a weak country caught between two giants. It's a non-actor because it lacks the power to act, not because it lacks the will.
Next, you are either ignorant of the history of Dalian or deliberately twisting it to fit your narrative. The Russians lost Dalian to the Japanese, and then we kicked the Japanese out. The Soviets later on tried to take over Zhengbao Island, and we beat them back. That's how history works, winner takes the cake. If the Russians had not been strong enough to take over Crimea, then you wouldn't be here whining about it.
I don't know where you get your funny ideas on China-Russia relations. "Ownership of Slavic peoples"? Really? I can only shake my head at the kind of deep-rooted brainwashing so many overseas Chinese harbor from exposure to Western media.
Saying Ukraine is a 'non-actor' because "it's controlled by the United States" is no different than how Westerners trivialize Chinese citizens capacity for critical thought since "we are all brainwashed/controlled by CCP propaganda".
My point is it's an oversimplification to dismiss Ukraine's capacity for critical thought as merely a byproduct of "US control" as if somehow centuries of Russian colonization has no bearing on it's pro-West, anti-Russian foreign policy.
I am using your words by applying it to another strategic naval base that Russian controlled (e.g. Port Arthur in Dalian)
If you let Russia get away with Crimean annexation because Sevastopol was a strategic port and vaguely "they exhibited hostility" then the same logic could apply to Russians annexing Port Arthur because of Boxer Rebellion, right? I know Port Arthur was conquered by Japan, but just saying, it could have been annexed by Russia using your logic and reasoning.
"ownership of Slavic people's" was more directed at this post rather than you.
Yes some overseas Chinese have drank the Russian kool-aid.
Last edited:
solarz
Brigadier
You exhibit that typical Western mentality of applying your own narrow morality to international relations.
Yeah, we get it, for whatever reason you don't like Russia. However, regardless of what you like or don't like, Russia is a vital security and economic partner of China. Russia's mere existence diverts half the US military away from China, and that alone would be reason enough to support Russia.
Finally, a comment on your "pit barbarians against barbarians" idea. That is a strategy invariably used by weakened Chinese dynasties, such as the late Qing dynasty. At best it is a ploy to kick the can down the road, and at worst it's a self-delusion designed to maintain the illusion of one's own superiority.
It is not kool aid. The existence of Ukraine as a separate entity distinct of Russia has been limited at best. At one point it was a part of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth then it went back into Russia. Those areas under the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth don't even include Crimea or Eastern and South Ukraine. And it was the Russian Empire who conquered Crimea from the Turks in the first place. Not Ukraine. Modern Ukraine dates from the fragmentation of the Soviet Union. Crimea was receded to the Ukrainian SSR (mostly a ceremonial exchange since it was still under the same Soviet Union) under Khrushchev not that long ago.
China may eventually have to pick a side, which is to maintain soft support for Russia with economic assistance in the case of crippling sanctions. Offering military support may just antagonize EU, which is still necessary as a vital trading and technology partner against a hardened North America.
In a perfect world, there may be a chance for China to potentially mediate between the two. Conversely, Russian ties to India are also a barrier to India fully linking with the US and enfeebling the QUAD.
What garbage pathetic false compliments was the above. Thats like saying:
"America makes Nazi Germany look absolutely tame, being the first nation in the world to successfully genocide another race out of existence (much less just a single ethnicity). But the american people are wonderful, they fully developed the hotdog with all the condiments and have some of the best comic books in the world."
FTFY
- Status