Ukraine Revolt/Civil War News, Reports, Data, etc.

J

Janiz

Senior Member
Jeff, it was stupid idea from the start to believe that Separatists in the middle of, more or less at the time, successful operation of Debaltseve encirclement would stop immediately after Minsk talks and agreement. They simply couldn't lose such a chance and put everything stall for time because of some talks and could always say that they weren't a side in Minsk talks and do whatever they want as they haven't signed anything. And there was strategical necessity to cut UA forces deep inside the frontline. A normal and sane decission on any war happening around the world.

So they simply continued offensive and kept their hands clean at the same time. A fine move by Mr Putin in an area where he couldn't be bothered by any serious armed forces far away in Eastern Europe...
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
I understand this...but then the agreement will end up backfiring because it will appear as if though it was a farce and set-up...and the blame will go to Putin on the international scene because he is viewed as the one on top of that side of the issue.

It will most probably not make much difference in terms of the conditions on the ground in the eastern Ukraine for sure...but it will play into further flung international relations and long term trust if this is indeed the case.
 
Zool

Zool

Junior Member
When Cease-Fire talks began, victory in Debaltseve was already a near certainty for the Separatists, as the encirclement had already been completed. It was not going to end any other way. Kiev has now relented and there is a withdrawal of the remaining UAF from the immediate area.

Going forward we will see if the events in Debaltseve and the treaty are to be used as:

A) a pause to re-group and re-arm before renewing the offensive (by Kiev or the Separatists).
B) a pretext by external powers, East or West, to intensify the larger Geopolitical conflict currently at play.
C) a genuine opportunity to scale down the conflict, reduce tensions and begin talks on how to re-structure Ukraine and restore international relations between the external powers.

It won't take long to see in which category the ball drops.
 
Jeff Head

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Zool said:
When Cease-Fire talks began, victory in Debaltseve was already a near certainty for the Separatists, as the encirclement had already been completed. It was not going to end any other way. Kiev has now relented and there is a withdrawal of the remaining UAF from the immediate area.

Going forward we will see if the events in Debaltseve and the treaty are to be used as:

A) a pause to re-group and re-arm before renewing the offensive (by Kiev or the Separatists).
B) a pretext by external powers, East or West, to intensify the larger Geopolitical conflict currently at play.
C) a genuine opportunity to scale down the conflict, reduce tensions and begin talks on how to re-structure Ukraine and restore international relations between the external powers.

It won't take long to see in which category the ball drops.
Click to expand...


Agreed.

Hopefully we will see it gravitate towards "C".
 
D

delft

Brigadier
The value of Debaltsevo as a base for further conquest and especially the encirclement of Donetsk, which likely was the intention in the summer was lost long ago and the continued occupation by some of the best forces of Kiev was militarily nonsense but it prevented rail transport between Donetsk and Lugansk and was so a function of the economic war by Kiev on the Donbass. And that is why the Donbass said the town was encircled and so not near the cease fire line. Kiev should go for a political compromise as it should have done in April. Possibility C. That btw is in line with what Putin has said all along.
 
Miragedriver

Miragedriver

Brigadier
potd-rockets_3204430k.jpg
Pro-Russian rebels stationed in the eastern Ukrainian city of Gorlivka, Donetsk region, launch missiles from Grad launch vehicles
Picture: AFP/Getty Images



Back to bottling my Grenache
 
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