Through out this I've been wondering how much sigint china's been able to gather, either directly or from the Russians.
The War in the Ukraine
- Thread starter SampanViking
- Start date
Absolutely nothing. Even if one or two Kinzhals were intercepted, that would still mean the missile has than 90+% success rate. If it was effective, the Americans would be displaying evidence for everyone to see of multiple Kinzhals being taken out.
By celebrating over what's probably a single dumb inert bomb jettisoned by a UAF plane and pretending its a Kinzhal, the Americans are tacitly admitting the Patriot is an ineffective platform.
One of the Patriot air defense systems delivered to Ukraine was damaged in a missile strike - CNN, citing an unnamed US administration official More likely permanently damaged but they won’t admit it. But I am surprised they admitted even half of the truth.
They could not spin this one because evidence was overwhelming.
US assessing potential damage of Patriot missile defense system following Russian attack near Kyiv
A US-made Patriot air defense system was likely damaged, but not destroyed, as the result of a Russian missile barrage in and around Kyiv early Tuesday morning local time, a US official tells CNN.
The US is still assessing to what degree the system was damaged, the official said. That will determine whether the system needs to be pulled back entirely or simply repaired on the spot by Ukrainians forces.
Russia’s Defense Ministry said on Tuesday in a post on Telegram that “a high-precision strike by the Kinzhal hypersonic missile system in the city of Kyiv hit a US-made Patriot anti-aircraft missile system.”
A US National Security Council spokesperson referred CNN to the Ukrainian government for comment.
Ukrainian officials said on Tuesday that they successfully intercepted all six hypersonic missiles fired by the Russians, but the Ukrainian military declined to comment on the Russians’ claim that a Patriot system was hit. “We cannot comment on this. We’ll stay out of commenting on Russian sources,” said the Ukrainian Air Force spokesman, Serhiy Ihnat.
Ukraine currently has two Patriot air defense systems in country, one donated by the US and the other donated jointly by Germany and the Netherlands. It is unclear which of those systems was potentially damaged, but taking one out of commission – even for a short period – could affect Ukraine’s ability to defend Kyiv amid intensifying Russian missile attacks.
Another US official said it is possible that the missile barrage hit one of the Patriot battery’s several components. A complete Patriot battery has six major components: generators, a radar set, a control station, antennas, a launcher station and interceptor missiles. The components operate together to fire a Patriot missile and successfully guide it to its target.
But extensive damage to one or more of the components may force Ukraine to take the system offline and out of country for more extensive repairs.
The Patriot has a powerful radar to detect incoming targets at long range, making it a potent air defense platform capable of intercepting ballistic missiles and more. But the radar emission necessary to spot threats at a distance also makes it possible for the enemy to detect the Patriot battery and figure out its location.
US officials believe the Russian military has been able to pick up on signals that are emitted from the Patriot, allowing them to target the system using the hypersonic missile, known as the Kinzhal or Killjoy. And unlike some shorter-range air defenses provided to Ukraine that are mobile and harder to target, the large Patriot battery is a larger and more stationary system, making it possible for the Russian forces to zero in on the location over time.
They could not spin this one because evidence was overwhelming.
US assessing potential damage of Patriot missile defense system following Russian attack near Kyiv
A US-made Patriot air defense system was likely damaged, but not destroyed, as the result of a Russian missile barrage in and around Kyiv early Tuesday morning local time, a US official tells CNN.
The US is still assessing to what degree the system was damaged, the official said. That will determine whether the system needs to be pulled back entirely or simply repaired on the spot by Ukrainians forces.
Russia’s Defense Ministry said on Tuesday in a post on Telegram that “a high-precision strike by the Kinzhal hypersonic missile system in the city of Kyiv hit a US-made Patriot anti-aircraft missile system.”
A US National Security Council spokesperson referred CNN to the Ukrainian government for comment.
Ukrainian officials said on Tuesday that they successfully intercepted all six hypersonic missiles fired by the Russians, but the Ukrainian military declined to comment on the Russians’ claim that a Patriot system was hit. “We cannot comment on this. We’ll stay out of commenting on Russian sources,” said the Ukrainian Air Force spokesman, Serhiy Ihnat.
Ukraine currently has two Patriot air defense systems in country, one donated by the US and the other donated jointly by Germany and the Netherlands. It is unclear which of those systems was potentially damaged, but taking one out of commission – even for a short period – could affect Ukraine’s ability to defend Kyiv amid intensifying Russian missile attacks.
Another US official said it is possible that the missile barrage hit one of the Patriot battery’s several components. A complete Patriot battery has six major components: generators, a radar set, a control station, antennas, a launcher station and interceptor missiles. The components operate together to fire a Patriot missile and successfully guide it to its target.
But extensive damage to one or more of the components may force Ukraine to take the system offline and out of country for more extensive repairs.
The Patriot has a powerful radar to detect incoming targets at long range, making it a potent air defense platform capable of intercepting ballistic missiles and more. But the radar emission necessary to spot threats at a distance also makes it possible for the enemy to detect the Patriot battery and figure out its location.
US officials believe the Russian military has been able to pick up on signals that are emitted from the Patriot, allowing them to target the system using the hypersonic missile, known as the Kinzhal or Killjoy. And unlike some shorter-range air defenses provided to Ukraine that are mobile and harder to target, the large Patriot battery is a larger and more stationary system, making it possible for the Russian forces to zero in on the location over time.
US officials are confirming Patriot got damaged (likely a launcher) but not destroyed. I'm guessing falling debris a warhead from caliber or kinzhal detonating near it would have destroyed it.
They just received it...what a waste. Firing non-stop that long certainly compromised its position. Target priority for air defences is hard to choose but it look like they are shoting all their assets on anything.
The radar is teh most expensive part of the battery, and most exposed.
If that get few shrapnel then done.
One radar cost at least half as much as a fighter jet .
But that dwarf the cost of expanded missiles of course : D
Other consideration, Iskander has several decoy , question , is there any with Kinzhal ?
If yes then it is possible to hit six missile, decoys most likelly easier and more obivous targets than the Kinzhal.
If that get few shrapnel then done.
One radar cost at least half as much as a fighter jet .
But that dwarf the cost of expanded missiles of course : D
Other consideration, Iskander has several decoy , question , is there any with Kinzhal ?
If yes then it is possible to hit six missile, decoys most likelly easier and more obivous targets than the Kinzhal.
If a whole bunch of missiles are used to maybe damage a patriot battary rather than any other targets, why is that a bad thing? It seems that AD is doing its job, since the US didn't give any numbers or details on what they have given the Ukranians, it's not like the Russians can ignore the patriot after this one strike.
Are patriot missiles fire and forget or do they require continuous guidance from the radar system?
If so no wonder it was taken out.
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PAC-3 are ARH while PAC-2 are SARH