Broccoli
Senior Member
Mi-8 shot down in same location.
The War in the Ukraine
- Thread starter SampanViking
- Start date
Broccoli
Senior Member
Now Russian telegram channels are reporting that friendly also shot down Su-35.
Not confirmed to be friendly fire. Fog of war speculations going on right now: patriot AD in Chernigov. Air to air, DRG's with manpads. Some suspect it could’ve been a large number of long-range air-to-air missiles fired from Chernihiv region inside Ukraine.
A Russian Su-34 fighter aircraft and a Mi-8 helicopter was shot down in the Bryan's region over Russian territory. The 2-man crew of the Su-34 was killed instantly in the air. The strength of the explosion and the fact that the downing of the Su-34 was over Russian territory implies that UkrAF has at least medium range SAMs near both the frontline and the Russian border in that region. This is the first Russian fighter aircraft shot down for many weeks.
Allegedly 2 Mi-8s, 1 Su-35 and 1 Su-34 were shot down
Broccoli
Senior Member
I believe Ukrainian SAM theory when there is evidence for it.
Today for the Russian Aerospace Forces is a disastrous day all the downing of today were friendly fire incidents.
It hasn't been confirmed to be friendly fire and i highly doubt it considering the amount of it
Too many cases to be friendly fire.
Also one of the helis seems to be a rare electronic warfare one, Mi-8MTPR-1 and it was a joint mission between many diferent machines.
So I would say AFU got info on this particular mission, moved a SAM batery to close range and ambushed the whole group.
Last edited:
plawolf
Lieutenant General
Seems very odd for fighter jets and helicopters to operate as a single group.
The Su35 might be fighter escort for the Su34(s), while the Mi8s might have been SAR or if an EW unit was indeed hit, EW support. But again, would be really unusual to use helicopters to support fighters since the helicopters will simply not be able to keep up. The EW Mi8 might have been EW for a SAR Mi8, but where is the evidence that one of the downed Mi8s was EW?
But no matter how you cut it, this is a big black eye for the Russians, whether it’s anything more will depend on what the broader impact might be on how the Russians use their TacAir assets going forwards and if they take any more losses doing so.
But one thing to note is that knowledge is power, especially in the modern digital age. The fact that NATO is allowed to observe Russian military operations at close range with impunity is just plain nuts as far as I am concerned. That’s the kind of intel that would simply be impossible for NATO to get so consistently and comprehensively if it was directly involved in the war, since it won’t be able to operate spy planes anything as close to the frontlines safely. This kind of close surveillance is one of, if not the biggest factors in how something like this can happen.
Frankly, the Russians shouldn’t have been so transparently scared of NATO escalation and direct confrontation. They should have gone all in and declared NATO assets directly involved in Ukrainian kill chains as active participants in combat operations and legitimate military targets.
Start small and salami slice right up to the red line, shoot down an UAV and gauge NATO response at a minimum since no one is going to start WWIII over a drone. But that ship is long sailed and they are taking a lot of needless losses because of how close NATO is allowed to gather intel on live combat operations.
The Su35 might be fighter escort for the Su34(s), while the Mi8s might have been SAR or if an EW unit was indeed hit, EW support. But again, would be really unusual to use helicopters to support fighters since the helicopters will simply not be able to keep up. The EW Mi8 might have been EW for a SAR Mi8, but where is the evidence that one of the downed Mi8s was EW?
But no matter how you cut it, this is a big black eye for the Russians, whether it’s anything more will depend on what the broader impact might be on how the Russians use their TacAir assets going forwards and if they take any more losses doing so.
But one thing to note is that knowledge is power, especially in the modern digital age. The fact that NATO is allowed to observe Russian military operations at close range with impunity is just plain nuts as far as I am concerned. That’s the kind of intel that would simply be impossible for NATO to get so consistently and comprehensively if it was directly involved in the war, since it won’t be able to operate spy planes anything as close to the frontlines safely. This kind of close surveillance is one of, if not the biggest factors in how something like this can happen.
Frankly, the Russians shouldn’t have been so transparently scared of NATO escalation and direct confrontation. They should have gone all in and declared NATO assets directly involved in Ukrainian kill chains as active participants in combat operations and legitimate military targets.
Start small and salami slice right up to the red line, shoot down an UAV and gauge NATO response at a minimum since no one is going to start WWIII over a drone. But that ship is long sailed and they are taking a lot of needless losses because of how close NATO is allowed to gather intel on live combat operations.