Wait so when we're discussing the possibility of internal side bays, no official recognition is required from Sukhoi but when we're talking about the write off, all of a sudden, the semantics imply some requirement of official Sukhoi recognition. Double standards much? Sukhoi hasn't confirmed write off like they haven't confirmed side bays. We can all speculate and our opinions are worth equal value, that being zero. But don't put others down for their's.
Russian Su-57 Aircraft Thread (PAK-FA and IAF FGFA)
- Thread starter A Bar Brother
- Start date
OMG ... that's exactly the same stupidity a certain member in another forum has:
- since I cannot deliver official documentation from CAC on what engines the J-20 uses it MUST be a +210kN WS-15 mated with a look-alike AL-31FN-nozzle only in order to fool such idiots like Deino.
- Since I cannot present official confirmation that China has no secret base on Mars it must be true.
But again, anyone can rely on his own believes regardless how wrong they are.
Deino
b787
Captain
Let me tell you this, any official information printed in a book that has direct input from the manufacturer and an air force, is widely known and acknowledged by different sources and in the case of Russia aired too on TV.
There are no secrets sources, unclassified information appears in books, magazines and TV programs and they have interviews with designers.
Andrei Fomin`s book Su-27 Flanker has in the first pages some letters written by guys like Vyacheslav Shport Tecnical director of KnAAPO plus others like Mikhail Simonov former General designer of Sukhoi, his book has direct input by Sukhoi, it has pictures that were first published when the book was printed.
To my knowledge Sukhoi never has claimed what you claim, nor i have i ever watched a program from such like TV zvesda claiming what you claim.
Is it stupid what i am asking you? i do not think so, historians need to have sources and reliable ones, in the case of PAKFA the best ones are interviews or statements made by Sukhoi.
If you have them show them, but what Sukhoi releases is usually released too in many Russian TV programs and books, thus the only thing i did is raise the stakes, great claims need great sources and in this case they need to come directly from the manufacturer.
But then we will probably never get any reliable specific data nor a confirmation since even if Sukhoi knows what happened they will never tell us simply due to propaganda issues ... and as such by Your logic it never happened ?
MY point is when You don't have any official confirmation or data for such controversial events You have to rely on those sources most close to the official ones and from what I know You are correct, no Sukhoi employee will at least by now confirm this but behind closed doors they all tell the same.
Deino
Deino "IS" an internationally recognized and published "SOURCE" B787,,, and in spite of your professed Faith, (which is a beautiful gift),,, you fail to "honor" your "elders" and superiors, and instead wish to diminish his honor, by constantly "questioning his integrity?"
all this to "build yourself up" at Master Deino's expense,, the Scriptures clearly state that as a professing Christian, we are to "give honor, unto whom honor is due",,, you could disagree with Master Deino, who is professionally a teacher and a fellow, and at the same time show a modicum of respect that an internationally published and peer reviewed author has earned??? couldn't you?? please? PLEASE?
end off topic: So while the SU-57 is indeed a very fine aircraft, it has suffered several serious setbacks, just as the F-22 AND F-35 have??? Why is that so hard for you to acknowledge??? when we have irrefutable photographic evidence of the damage, published by Sukhoi and other Russian sources that corroborate Master Deino's other sources???
Deino is among the first here to offer clarification when someone asks repectfully,, so why not show a little respect to others, who work very hard to maintain their accuracy and integrity??
It's nice the see the SU-57 coming into the light of day, and Sukhoi are quite forthcoming with positive details and claims for their aircraft,,, but they are a state owned entity, and the Russian government is not now, nor is it likely ever? to be known for serious introspection and candor??
b787
Captain
I would agree with you if i was not a reader of Russian aviation books like I am, if you have ever read books about Su-24, there is one very good by Yefim Gordon, He mentions in the history of the development of the Su-24 the same things the Russian video by Wings of Russia Studio does, how hard it was to develop the Fencer in human lives and technology, in Fact the Video of wings of Russia about MiG-25, is so good that they mention the technical problems they had with the horizontal tail and the trailing edge of the main wings and how it costed several pilots lives.
So i can assure you that if what you say it is true, it will be known because any one knows prototypes have development problems, that is the reason they build a few before main productions starts, and the Russians do not keep the lid on such issues forever.
I can tell you that since I am a follower of Russian aviation since 1984, the disagreement with your assertions by my part is you are treating unconfirmed sources as official sources.
Is what you claim potentially true? yes it could be, I am open enough to know at this moment Sukhoi will not release a lot of details about the development program of Su-57.
But it is a fact T-50-055 was written off? no it is not, at least by official sources, it is not.
Could it be true? yes it could, is it a fact it did happen as you are saying? no it is not.
I am a trained Historian my self, in my youth i studied History and Archeology at university as a degree, I am also an engineer, and I know we have to treat sources with special care, because sources are not 100% reliable all the time, and in this case there is not official confirmation thus you only need to add there are unconfirmed reports of 055 being a rebuilt aircraft with 056 parts, but these are internet rumours, if you wish.
But it is not a fact the 055 prototype was written off, at least Sukhoi has never confirmed it thus such claim can be also a rumour and thus false.
b787
Captain
the scripture also says adulating is not the best way to be a friend, it says too a true friend is honest, in this case i am not disrespecting him, i am simply not agreeing because there is not official confirmation, and thus in such case the best way to treat such claim is saying there are unconfirmed reports, but there is no confirmation of such details by the manufacturer thus is better to treat such claim as unconfirmed because if it is not true, then any historian knows it is better to treat such thing in that way.