Russian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

Michaelsinodef

Senior Member
Registered Member
Multiple smaller ships are better than one big ship. Having a big ship just gives the enemy a bigger target to sink.

It's time for Russia to stop trying to do everything and just buy Chinese ships.
Sometimes smaller ships can't replace bigger ships though.

At the end, I think a mix is the way to go (more smaller than bigger), which seems to be the way China is gonna go (more 052Ds than 055s).

As for Russia buying chinese ships, I think there's actually a chance for that happening in the future (also other military hardware).
 

pmc

Major
Registered Member
They bought Mistrals from France. Why wouldn't they buy LHDs at least from China?
that time French industry was advanced for quality and efficiency but still Russia build considerable part of Mistral. thats why the price of two Mistrals was really cheap $1.1b considering modifications for Russian conditions and Ka-52K.
now they using that experience to create modern ship. unless Chinese ship building methods for naval ships really advanced not just incremental improvement that will overcome the barriers to industrial tie-ups.
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Jingle Bells

Junior Member
Registered Member
that time French industry was advanced for quality and efficiency but still Russia build considerable part of Mistral. thats why the price of two Mistrals was really cheap $1.1b considering modifications for Russian conditions and Ka-52K.
now they using that experience to create modern ship. unless Chinese ship building methods for naval ships really advanced not just incremental improvement that will overcome the barriers to industrial tie-ups.
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I remember researching about these ship as an aftermath of the breaking of the Mistral deal quite a few years ago. I read back then that this lead ship will be battle ready by 2027.

That's very slow for delivery, as Russia would actually benefit hugely from these ship, if they could be in commission much earlier.

In my opinion, Russian leadership should have just let the French build the 4 ships, if that means getting them commissioned earlier.
 

Jingle Bells

Junior Member
Registered Member
I am not sure if the Russians really did had big plan for their navy or just brag a lot to divert attention from the state’s much straitened means being incompatible with its chauvinistic bluster

The plans the Russians claim to have is all out of proportion to the size of Russia’s economy.
Well, the thing is, Russia's nuclear triad is not complete without their world leading advanced SSN's and SSBN's. This means that Russia will need to maintain an adequately strong navy at the very least. The thought that Russia should have not major advanced surface ships and ONLY build advanced nuclear submarines is flawed.

Russia will need medium to small size advanced surface fleet made of powerful and advanced large ships. In my opinion, a potent battle groups centered around 3 large-to-heavy aircraft carriers would be the minimum.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
Well, the thing is, Russia's nuclear triad is not complete without their world leading advanced SSN's and SSBN's. This means that Russia will need to maintain an adequately strong navy at the very least. The thought that Russia should have not major advanced surface ships and ONLY build advanced nuclear submarines is flawed.

Russia will need medium to small size advanced surface fleet made of powerful and advanced large ships. In my opinion, a potent battle groups centered around 3 large-to-heavy aircraft carriers would be the minimum.
submarine bastion defense doesn't require carriers.

They need LHDs fitted with tons of ASW helicopters and capable of deploying marine teams with SAMs and ASM, corvettes, frigates and ground based naval aviation. All this is to counter enemy subs and keep enemy airborne ASW away. If enemy ASW is kept away then their SSNs can sink enemy surface targets.

Carriers and cruisers just more expensive capital assets when they really need to get back to basics and field more competent frigates and corvettes. Their capital assets are their SSNs and SSBNs.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
They bought Mistrals from France. Why wouldn't they buy LHDs at least from China?

It is not impossible, but the rationale for buying Mistrals at the time was because the Mistral purchase from France was accompanied by ToT and workshare for Russian shipyards (half of each of the two Mistrals they bought were fabricated in Russia).
That is to say, the goal of the Mistral purchase wasn't simply to have LHDs, but also to develop some shipyard competencies.

With the failure and cancellation of the delivery of the completed ships, Russia didn't get the LHDs they wanted, but their shipyards did complete much of the work they were contracted for. Which is important.

Since then, Russia has initiated its own Pr 23900 LHD class -- again partly because they want LHDs, but also partly because they need to support their own shipyards in building complex naval ships.


So the question of "why wouldn't they buy LHDs at least from China" imo is the wrong one -- instead it should be "does Russia want LHDs due to an urgent requirement for LHD capability, or is there major industry/shipbuilding factors as well"?


IMO, I'm sure Russia would love to have a couple of LHDs in service within a few years, which I'm sure that China could complete and deliver to them faster than Russia's projected entry into service for their Pr 23900s (which itself is likely to experience delays).
But I don't think Russia is so desperate for LHDs that they would be willing to have their shipyards lose out on the valuable work and experience of developing and building their own ships, given shipbuilding of naval ships is a strategic industry.
 
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