May I ask, why it is so much unbelievable and more likely sunk by accident than indeed an Ukrainian missile attack?
Russian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.
- Thread starter tphuang
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May I ask, why it is so much unbelievable and more likely sunk by accident than indeed an Ukrainian missile attack?
escobar
Brigadier
It should have been retired ages ago, but the VMF has such a severe shortage of major surface combatants that these are kept.
Yeah it should have been put to pasture years ago. The US has already retired and scrapped similarly aged Ticos.
But the thing is Russia does not have a proper replacement for these ships. They are so old an Admiral Gorshkov-class frigate is basically more capable than these are. But you can't call that a replacement. It simply does not have the same endurance or even air defense missile magazine depth. The frigates have same depth of surface attack magazines and the surface attack missiles are more flexible though.
If they managed to get all the crew out safely that is more important and valuable than keeping the ship I guess.
But the thing is Russia does not have a proper replacement for these ships. They are so old an Admiral Gorshkov-class frigate is basically more capable than these are. But you can't call that a replacement. It simply does not have the same endurance or even air defense missile magazine depth. The frigates have same depth of surface attack magazines and the surface attack missiles are more flexible though.
If they managed to get all the crew out safely that is more important and valuable than keeping the ship I guess.
if other warship gunnery magazine explosion is any guide, such an explosion would probably sink the ship on the spot.
because it is less embarrassing for the russians to lose a major warship to enemy action than to a own goal? so the fact that admitted it was own goal probably meant it really was own goal?
For some reason being sunk by sheer incompetence alone is less embarrassing than being sunk by incompetence plus Ukrainian missiles.
Unfortunately we may only get the real view once someone actually deploy submersible there to inspect her wreckage.
Well if you ask me. It started from the weather map At the time of her being supposedly attacked there were storm, Sea state 6-7. Now Neptun shared considerable amount of characteristics with Uran including a 4 m terminal phase. This not really bodes well with sea state and Uran itself is rated for sea state 5-6. The missile will indeed fly higher in mid-course phase to acquire target. This presented the opportunity for early detection, except it might be not long. Before the missile dive after the acquisition phase is complete.
But flying at sea state 6-7 at 4 m can actually risk the missile hit wave and at speed of 500-900 km it might be like hitting a wall. That's what i am thinking of.
While mines, there are reports that mines around Odessa got washed away and even there were reports that mine were actually found near Bosporus. The thing is How many of them still not found and freely floats around. That one still floating can be the joker that brought Moskva her sad fate. Russian themselves had bit of safety issues which lend me to also think of the accident theory.
I understand tho that my thoughts above is not perfect e.g Missile can use its own radar seeker for wave avoidance or simply be set to fly higher (e.g 5-7 m) during terminal phase. and
Sea state, distance from shore (not just in terms of reach but in terms of targeting data acquisition), and how Russian Navy has historically been accident prone even just in the last 20 years.
At this rate, you are pedaling conspiracy which is frankly beneath you as a mod.
The Russians have no reason to hide the fact if it was struck by Ukrainian missiles. In fact Putin could use the outrage to escalate his war.
Instead they've been saying it was an inboard incident. Even the US are saying the reasons are unknown and they--the US--have no reason to deny Ukrainians a kill if they really did sink the flagship.
The Russians didn't lie or hide Ukrainian helicopter runs attack deep into Russian territory and that was embarrassing enough. Why would they start now.
They will never purchase any major arms from PLA. I think sub-systems, radars, and chips are more likely. Even drones too, but naval ships, aircraft. Never.Looks like time for Russia to purchase or barter for some of China's Type 052D destroyer or Type 054B frigates to make up for the lost and therefore be able to confront any Western naval power in the Black Sea.
The Russian Navy has big plans. They just need the funding. I don't think they will ever build another cruiser. Just an enlarge version of the Gorshkov frigates to become destroyers. The Lider-class if it ever becomes a reality might be designated a cruiser or battle-cruiser.