PLAN Type 035/039/091/092 Submarine Thread

franco-russe

Senior Member
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

OK, this is what I see in Google Earth, where there fortunately are reasonably updated images:

Huludao 26.02.13
1 x 094 (Hull 4 launched December 2011)
1 x 093(B) (Hull 3 launched December 2012)

Xiaopingdao 07.03.13
1 x 094 (Hull 3?)
1 x 032 (201)
1 x 031 (200)
2 x 039B (341, 341?)

Shazikou 05.07.13
1 x 094
4 x 091 including one in drydock (being dismantled?)

For good measure, a look at Yulin:

05.07.13
1 x 094
1 x 093

27.06.12
1 x 094
2 x 093
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

Well I think by all account we can reach a consensus that we have 3 x Type 093A/B SSN and 4 x Type 094 SSBN

Once Type 095 and Type 096 enter service all Type 091 and single Type 092 will be retired
 
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Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

OK, this is what I see in Google Earth:

Huludao 26.02.13
1 x 094 (Hull 4 launched December 2011)
1 x 093(B) (Hull 3 launched December 2012)

Xiaopingdao 07.03.13
1 x 094 (Hull 3?)
1 x 032 (201)
1 x 031 (200)
2 x 039B (341, 341?)

Shazikou 05.07.13
1 x 094
4 x 091 including one in drydock (being dismantled?)

For good measure, a look at Yulin:

27.06.12
1 x 094
2 x 093

I believe another Type 093B has been launched this year. We just haven't seen it yet. That's the 4th I believe is in existance.

So, based on that, it would leaves us with:

3 x Type 091 SSN (the fourth I believe is decommissioned)
2 x Type 093 SSN
2 Type 093B SSN (with the new launch which we have not seen on Google earth yet)

1 x Type 092 SSBN (Not shown above, but we all know she is in service)
4 x Type 094 SSBN

That's how I come to 12 nuclear subs altogether. If another Type 093B has not been launched, then it's 11.
 

asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

Four SSBN is a pretty good fleet and the Type 093B must be a improvement on Type 093 but I would like to think the Type 095 is going to be the true carrier task force escort, fast and quite

The thing with SSBN is that it's not a weapon of war but then it's exactly a weapon of war, ready deployed and operating somewhere in the depths

It works because it's like some has a finger on the trigger, ready to pull and that is the mission, it avoids escalation and avoids wars it's a deterrence which saves lives (which I know kind of sounds like a contradiction) but you get the drift

It's a political and military statement which again has to be part of all major naval weapons, which I may add are very very expansive to operate
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
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Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

That said this is the Washington times... And the global times as a source isn't exactly confidence inspiring... But apparently a global times article claimed JL-2 has a rate of 8700miles, which is 14,000 km?? That is a massive increase compared to the 7200-8000km estimates of the US. Is it possible western intelligence got it wrong on another high profile weapons project, or is the global times peddling BS again?

A source to the original article would be great




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Inside China: Nuclear submarines capable of widespread attack on U.S.

Chinese state-run media revealed for the first time this week that Beijing’s nuclear submarines can attack American cities as a means to counterbalance U.S. nuclear deterrence in the Pacific.

On Monday, leading media outlets including China Central TV, the People’s Daily, the Global Times, the PLA Daily, the China Youth Daily and the Guangmin Daily ran identical, top-headlined reports about the “awesomeness” of the People's Liberation Army navy’s strategic submarine force.


“This is the first time in 42 years since the establishment of our navy’s strategic submarine force that we reveal on such a large scale the secrets of our first-generation underwater nuclear force,” the Global Times said in a lengthy article titled “China for the First Time Possesses Effective Underwater Nuclear Deterrence against the United States.”

The article features 30 photos and graphics detailing, among other things, damage projections for Seattle and Los Angeles after being hit by Chinese nuclear warheads and the deadly radiation that would spread all the way to Chicago.
China’s sub fleet is reportedly the world’s second-largest, with about 70 vessels. About 10 are nuclear-powered, and four or more of those are nuclear ballistic submarines capable of launching missiles.

Heavily influenced by Soviet naval models that stressed underwater forces, China’s nuclear submarine development began with the reverse-engineering of a Soviet Golf-class conventional-powered sub in the 1950s.
In the 1980s, China developed its first ballistic missile sub, the Type 092 Xia-class, which has 12 launch tubes for the Julang (Giant Wave)-1 missiles. The JL-1 had a limited range and failed multiple test launches.
In 2010, a new class of missile sub, the Type 094 Jin class, entered the service. It is capable of launching 12 to 16 JL-2 missiles with a range of about 8,700 miles, covering much of the continental U.S. with single or multiple, independently targetable re-entry vehicle warheads.

Chinese calculations for nuclear attacks on the U.S. are chillingly macabre.

“Because the Midwest states of the U.S. are sparsely populated, in order to increase the lethality, [our] nuclear attacks should mainly target the key cities on the West Coast of the United States, such as Seattle, Los Angeles, San Francisco and San Diego,” the Global Times said.

“The 12 JL-2 nuclear warheads carried by one single Type 094 SSBN can kill and wound 5 million to 12 million Americans,” the Global Times reported.
China also has developed land-based intercontinental ballistic missiles — notably the DF-31A, which has a range of 7,000 to 7,500 miles.

“If we launch our DF 31A ICBMs over the North Pole, we can easily destroy a whole list of metropolises on the East Coast and the New England region of the U.S., including Annapolis, Philadelphia, New York, Boston, Portland, Baltimore and Norfolk, whose population accounts for about one-eighth of America’s total residents,” the Global Times said.

All the state-run press reports stressed the point that the PLA’s missile submarines are now on routine strategic patrol, “which means that China for the first time has acquired the strategic deterrence and second strike capability against the United States.”

“Our JL-2 SLBMs have become the fourth type of Chinese nuclear missiles that threaten the continental United States, after our DF-31A, DF-5A and DF-5B ICBMs,” said the Global Times.
 

tphuang

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

That said this is the Washington times... And the global times as a source isn't exactly confidence inspiring... But apparently a global times article claimed JL-2 has a rate of 8700miles, which is 14,000 km?? That is a massive increase compared to the 7200-8000km estimates of the US. Is it possible western intelligence got it wrong on another high profile weapons project, or is the global times peddling BS again?

A source to the original article would be great




Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!


Inside China: Nuclear submarines capable of widespread attack on U.S.

Chinese state-run media revealed for the first time this week that Beijing’s nuclear submarines can attack American cities as a means to counterbalance U.S. nuclear deterrence in the Pacific.

On Monday, leading media outlets including China Central TV, the People’s Daily, the Global Times, the PLA Daily, the China Youth Daily and the Guangmin Daily ran identical, top-headlined reports about the “awesomeness” of the People's Liberation Army navy’s strategic submarine force.


“This is the first time in 42 years since the establishment of our navy’s strategic submarine force that we reveal on such a large scale the secrets of our first-generation underwater nuclear force,” the Global Times said in a lengthy article titled “China for the First Time Possesses Effective Underwater Nuclear Deterrence against the United States.”

The article features 30 photos and graphics detailing, among other things, damage projections for Seattle and Los Angeles after being hit by Chinese nuclear warheads and the deadly radiation that would spread all the way to Chicago.
China’s sub fleet is reportedly the world’s second-largest, with about 70 vessels. About 10 are nuclear-powered, and four or more of those are nuclear ballistic submarines capable of launching missiles.

Heavily influenced by Soviet naval models that stressed underwater forces, China’s nuclear submarine development began with the reverse-engineering of a Soviet Golf-class conventional-powered sub in the 1950s.
In the 1980s, China developed its first ballistic missile sub, the Type 092 Xia-class, which has 12 launch tubes for the Julang (Giant Wave)-1 missiles. The JL-1 had a limited range and failed multiple test launches.
In 2010, a new class of missile sub, the Type 094 Jin class, entered the service. It is capable of launching 12 to 16 JL-2 missiles with a range of about 8,700 miles, covering much of the continental U.S. with single or multiple, independently targetable re-entry vehicle warheads.

Chinese calculations for nuclear attacks on the U.S. are chillingly macabre.

“Because the Midwest states of the U.S. are sparsely populated, in order to increase the lethality, [our] nuclear attacks should mainly target the key cities on the West Coast of the United States, such as Seattle, Los Angeles, San Francisco and San Diego,” the Global Times said.

“The 12 JL-2 nuclear warheads carried by one single Type 094 SSBN can kill and wound 5 million to 12 million Americans,” the Global Times reported.
China also has developed land-based intercontinental ballistic missiles — notably the DF-31A, which has a range of 7,000 to 7,500 miles.

“If we launch our DF 31A ICBMs over the North Pole, we can easily destroy a whole list of metropolises on the East Coast and the New England region of the U.S., including Annapolis, Philadelphia, New York, Boston, Portland, Baltimore and Norfolk, whose population accounts for about one-eighth of America’s total residents,” the Global Times said.

All the state-run press reports stressed the point that the PLA’s missile submarines are now on routine strategic patrol, “which means that China for the first time has acquired the strategic deterrence and second strike capability against the United States.”

“Our JL-2 SLBMs have become the fourth type of Chinese nuclear missiles that threaten the continental United States, after our DF-31A, DF-5A and DF-5B ICBMs,” said the Global Times.

I'm not sure global times is always telling facts when it comes to PLA. A lot of pieces seem to just be boasting by the hawks. When it comes to JL-2, the original version's range is 8000 km. There is apparently a JL-2A will longer range (maybe truly global range). 094s are definitely not capable of launching more than 12 JL-2s.
 

Blitzo

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Staff member
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Registered Member
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

Global times have definitely been known to BS before, and it does sound like boasting.

However there was that interview from a few days ago where it was claimed (that rear admiral Yin Zhou) JL-2 is an "ICBM," and the show made it clear that the PLA definition of ICBM is a missile with a range beyond 8000km where as missiles of 3000-8000km were classed as "long range missiles," so I think there's enough to speculate whether western intelligence estimates need a bit of a tweak.

We know there's a JL-2A under development because of that famous plaque of 032 SSBE, but an improvement of the existing JL-2 could be to increase warhead number, countermeasures, rather than range.
 
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asif iqbal

Lieutenant General
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II

Everyone is cutting down the number of missiles carried with no reduction in warheads as technology improves, replacement of the Ohio Class will not be carrying 24 missiles and maybe cut to 16

Now if Type 096 SSBN upgrades to 16 missiles with similar warhead capability the overall firepower between PLAN SSBN and USN SSBN will be the same

France and UK both use 16 launchers for SSBN too
 
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