PLAN Type 035/039/091/092 Submarine Thread
- Thread starter crobato
- Start date
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II
how can you tell from this far away, you must have x-ray eyes!
how can you tell from this far away, you must have x-ray eyes!
Mysterre
Banned Idiot
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II
You just have to know what features to look for. Those are clearly all Yuan. Just stare at a Kilo photo long enough and you'll be able to tell the difference as well.
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II
Very good information, although I am not as optimistic as the author regarding USN's ability in operating near China's coastal water with little attrition in a direct conflict scenario. SSN loses many of its advantages in shallow water against SSK, and bad acoustic environment applies equally to all sonars. In fact, shallow water favors SSK on battery, not to mention it is much more difficult for an SSN to "clear datum" after a kill (quickly leave the battle engagement area so not to be the hunted) in shoal water. It simply cannot run fast for fear of cavitation, as the author pointed out that all propellers do in shallow water.
Very good information, although I am not as optimistic as the author regarding USN's ability in operating near China's coastal water with little attrition in a direct conflict scenario. SSN loses many of its advantages in shallow water against SSK, and bad acoustic environment applies equally to all sonars. In fact, shallow water favors SSK on battery, not to mention it is much more difficult for an SSN to "clear datum" after a kill (quickly leave the battle engagement area so not to be the hunted) in shoal water. It simply cannot run fast for fear of cavitation, as the author pointed out that all propellers do in shallow water.
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II
Why would an SSN want to operate in shoal waters anyway? The risk of running aground is too great I would say. And the new propulsors on the Seawolf and Virginia classes favor quiet operations in shallower waters. Well not too shallow I should add.
"....Advantages for pumpjet propulsors
Pump jets have some advantages over bare propellers for certain applications, usually related to requirements for high-speed or shallow-draft operations. These include:
Higher speed before the onset of cavitation, because of the raised internal static pressure
High power density (with respect to volume) of both the propulsor and the prime mover (because a smaller, higher-speed unit can be used)
Protection of the rotating element, making operation safer around swimmers and aquatic life
Improved shallow-water operations, because only the inlet needs to be submerged
Increased maneuverability, by adding a steerable nozzle to create vectored thrust
Noise reduction, resulting in a low sonar signature; this particular system has little in common with other pump-jet propulsors and is also known as "shrouded propeller configuration";[2] applications:
submarines, for example the Royal Navy Trafalgar-class and Astute-class, the US Navy Seawolf-class, Virginia-class, the French Navy Triomphant class, and the Russian Navy Borei class. modern torpedoes, such as the Spearfish, the Mk 48 and Mk 50 weapons...."
Why would an SSN want to operate in shoal waters anyway? The risk of running aground is too great I would say. And the new propulsors on the Seawolf and Virginia classes favor quiet operations in shallower waters. Well not too shallow I should add.
"....Advantages for pumpjet propulsors
Pump jets have some advantages over bare propellers for certain applications, usually related to requirements for high-speed or shallow-draft operations. These include:
Higher speed before the onset of cavitation, because of the raised internal static pressure
High power density (with respect to volume) of both the propulsor and the prime mover (because a smaller, higher-speed unit can be used)
Protection of the rotating element, making operation safer around swimmers and aquatic life
Improved shallow-water operations, because only the inlet needs to be submerged
Increased maneuverability, by adding a steerable nozzle to create vectored thrust
Noise reduction, resulting in a low sonar signature; this particular system has little in common with other pump-jet propulsors and is also known as "shrouded propeller configuration";[2] applications:
submarines, for example the Royal Navy Trafalgar-class and Astute-class, the US Navy Seawolf-class, Virginia-class, the French Navy Triomphant class, and the Russian Navy Borei class. modern torpedoes, such as the Spearfish, the Mk 48 and Mk 50 weapons...."
Re: PLAN submarines Thread II
That was the author's scenario. I most certainly would not if i were the armed chair admiral. Pump jets may allow higher speed before the onset, but they too will cavitate. At 200m water, which means 150m-160m operating depth, do you think a sub can run 15 knots w/o cavitating? Once you hit someome with a torpedo, 15 knots is hardly the getaway speed a sub skipper would like to do, especially when going deep is not an option.
That was the author's scenario. I most certainly would not if i were the armed chair admiral. Pump jets may allow higher speed before the onset, but they too will cavitate. At 200m water, which means 150m-160m operating depth, do you think a sub can run 15 knots w/o cavitating? Once you hit someome with a torpedo, 15 knots is hardly the getaway speed a sub skipper would like to do, especially when going deep is not an option.
