Yeah, I haven't heard of any news that suggesting CVN-80 would revert to steam catapults either... so I'm curious as to what Intrepid is referring to.
PLAN Catapult Development Thread, News, etc.
- Thread starter antiterror13
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Yeah, I haven't heard of any news that suggesting CVN-80 would revert to steam catapults either... so I'm curious as to what Intrepid is referring to.
In short answer, yes.
However, I'm really not sure about what this "competition" that people talk about really mean. Does that mean it's like a 100-meter run, and whoever finishes first is declared winner (and that's why they were put side by side at the same place)? I believe there are probably assessments going on to compare the two technologies in many aspects, beyond just technical performance. It's way too simplistic to boil it down to some technical merit comparison. There are other, larger points to consider too.
I imagine the parameters will mostly be technical, but it wont' be the ones that people are imagining.
For instance, I imagine at this stage, both of the two systems would already have undergone rigorous testing at their own individual sites with a variety of dead-loads, at various weights, including probably simulated aircraft weights. So those sort of technical parameters should already be sealed in.
What I think this "competition" will do, is first to verify their capability in launching aircraft, but then proceed to compare technical parameters like the mean time between fail of the two catapults, and also how well they fare in a higher pace of simulated operations, maybe how easy it is to maintain the two catapult designs during high pace operations etc.
In other words, I imagine they will be judging the reliability, ruggedness of the two catapults. That is the only way in which this "competition" makes sense, because it's not like the two catapults are new designs that have never been tested before, and both teams should already know how well each catapult performs, but the Navy appears to have been willing to give the EM catapult a vote of confidence by asking for a competition to see whether EM or steam is more reliable at the moment, and if EM is more reliable (or potentially even only "as reliable") then they may bypass steam altogether.
Evening all, I'd just like to add my opinion to the discussion.
Bear in mind that for the PLAN, they have had zero experience with either steam catapults or EMALS. Therefore, I believe that there is no such thing as a "safer" choice for them. Both technologies are untested, so both are equally viable from a technical point of view.
Earlier in this thread, somebody mentioned that the Chinese tend to make faster progress when it comes to electrical engineering rather than mechanical engineering, which I also believe is the case.
However, there have also been reports that the 002's development was a case of 'steam catapult waiting for the carrier'. In other words, the steam catapult has been ready for a while now. Then of course, Admiral Ma came out of nowhere and brought up his EMALS as an alternative, which the PLAN has given a fair chance so far.
That being said, I don't think it's fair to guess at what type of catapult they would fit on the 002. Did the PLAN come to a decision? Probably yes. However, they have leaked absoutely nothing about decision, only news from both sides (steam vs. EMALS) about having "confidence" in their respective projects. In other words, we cannot guess.
That's my 2 cents.
Bear in mind that for the PLAN, they have had zero experience with either steam catapults or EMALS. Therefore, I believe that there is no such thing as a "safer" choice for them. Both technologies are untested, so both are equally viable from a technical point of view.
Earlier in this thread, somebody mentioned that the Chinese tend to make faster progress when it comes to electrical engineering rather than mechanical engineering, which I also believe is the case.
However, there have also been reports that the 002's development was a case of 'steam catapult waiting for the carrier'. In other words, the steam catapult has been ready for a while now. Then of course, Admiral Ma came out of nowhere and brought up his EMALS as an alternative, which the PLAN has given a fair chance so far.
That being said, I don't think it's fair to guess at what type of catapult they would fit on the 002. Did the PLAN come to a decision? Probably yes. However, they have leaked absoutely nothing about decision, only news from both sides (steam vs. EMALS) about having "confidence" in their respective projects. In other words, we cannot guess.
That's my 2 cents.
Intrepid
Major
It is not the catapults in particular, it is the huge amount of electrical power that is needed on the new ships. And the power supply is the problem. Something to read:
And yes, I think, they will solve the problems. But it is a hard way to implement new complex technic. And the new carriers are not reliable in the first ten years of their service. And they are years behind schedule.
The number of reliable US-Navy carriers will go down from eleven to eight for the next fifteen to twenty years.
China will draw their own conclusion about this mess.
Yes, this is very common in complex systems. It's not just about the unit test, there is also potential issues associated with integration. And we're talking about the USN, which has tons of experience operating steam catapult and building carriers in general (I'm fully aware of steam catapult and EMALS are different technologies, but still...)
I'm also fully confident they will solve the problem, eventually. And the USN can afford some delay - they still have 10 Nimitz class super-carriers in operation.
As for PLAN, CATOBAR carrier is new, EMAILS is new and has been under development in shorter time (therefore less time for testing), and they have zero CATOBAR carrer in operation. If you're the PLAN top brass, do you want to postpone the construction for a few years to allow for redesign and risk potentially additional time delay associated with the integration issues? I doubt it.
Now, I'm aware of the fact that steam catapult is also new for China. But that technology has been under development much longer and is said to be "ready" for some time now based on credible source.
Plan will follow USN while it had the choice while USN had no choice when it ordered development of EMALS?
Intrepid
Major
PLAN will carefully watch US-Navy to avoid the same mistakes. Some day in the future they will change position and US-Navy will watch PLAN.
The new carrier has more than enough power. Those new reactors are simply amazing.
They may be experiencing distribution problems since the electrical system itself is also all new.
But they will solve it, and EMALs will operate on all of the Ford Class.
of that I am quite confident.
As for 002...I expect that the PLAN will take the safe route to get to CATOBAR and develop all of the policies and experience with it that they need...which does not require EMALs.
The US has ten Nimitz class carriers, all with steam, which they will be operating until the last olne, the GW Bush, CVN-77 is decommissioned almost 50 years from now. So it is clear that you do not need EMALs to develop and operate CATOBAR carriers...but you do need CATOBAR carriers and steam is there and much easier IMHO, for the PLAN to implement.
So, to begin with (for their first two) I expect that is what they will do.
Then, with 003, after the US has worked out all of the bugs and issues, the PLAN will follow suite. They have no reason to hurry and try and be first and take the risk.
Since the US already has ten super, nuclear powered, CATOBAR carriers, it is not as big a risk at all for the USN either.