Hopefully not years as in their hypersonic missile programs has been going on for years, their rail gun project has been going on for years, been ironing out problems with ford class for years, been ironing out F-35 problems for years, looking to get replacements for burkes and new gen frigates for years, been delaying getting back to the moon for years... well you get my drift.
PLA next/6th generation fighter thread
- Thread starter Blitzo
- Start date
Planes going faster and faster is never happening. This kind of race happened in the 60s when Mig-31 and Sr-71 was developed. Manned planes can never go too fast without getting to the limit of G-Forces. Moreover, Turbofan engines will never be efficient enough for that. In the 60s, people used turbojets which went that fast.
Interesting perspective.
two points to add. Stealth tech is evolving as much as counter stealth although it appears that counter stealth is much more multi dimensional/domain than stealth material and signals management. The race between the two encompasses all of electronic warfare since there isn't a fine line at all between sensor and network spoofing and the comprehensive definition of "stealth technology".
As TI mentioned in his post, variable cycle engines is probably the true defining feature of 6th gen that 5th gens cannot be upgraded to incorporate in the same way plenty of post 2010s variant 4.5 gen fighters incorporated 5th gen technologies (obviously baked in shaping and material stealth isn't one of those but there are others).
6th gen definitely aims to significantly increase range and time in air. Tailless almost certainly removes some turning performance with all design parameters, limitations and factors being equal. Stealthier everything sure. Effectiveness and worthy or pursuing is unknown since counter stealth is so secretive due to its sensitivity. Speed and altitude of operation is an interesting topic. These help increase range in physical terms so it certainly helps if you have that capability. Hypersonic speed would add immense range to your ordinance but they'd need to be redesigned completely. It also takes dogfighting almost completely out of the equation.
I do not believe either China or the US have the funds to develop and procure multiple platforms - typical speed and hypersonic (very difficult if not impossible to have one that performs acceptably between mach 0.6 and mach 6). You still need a fighter to be able to fly low and/or slow or various missions. If you want a dedicated platform then you need more than one for all your mission profiles. Then you add in the supporting platforms - UCAVs, loitering high speed drones, different types of UAVs and swarm drones, missile trucks etc. Too many platforms to develop. Could be more cost effective to develop much better A2A and a high speed, high altitude multirole strike aircraft like JH-xy which can act as a networked A2A missile truck and a multirole fighter that can do A2A and A2G as secondary role. Flight speed of former mach 1 to 3 if possible (extremely unlikely to be above mach 2 capable until next gen) and fighter mach 0.6 to mach 2.x
At hypersonic speeds there will be no more dog fights. There may even be no more plane-on-plane intercepts and traditional intercepts. And the focus may shift from undetectable to uninterceptable, both the platform and the ordnance that it is carrying.
It may even replace or largely complement the role of ICBMs, to such an extent that it will not be used against territories of nuclear-retaliatory capable nations, due to possibility of intent being misjudged. But it may be used against other actors and as area denial platforms.
Ideally a 6th gen platform will be able to take off like normal plane and have a certain degree of stealth so that it will not be detected by early warning systems the same way that ICBMs would. Then at supersonic speed and high altitudes it switches to hypersonic engine for hypersonic flight. At this point stealth degradation is not so much of an issue due to speed and altitude and changeable trajectory, neither will it be important for return leg. Once it is detected at hypersonic flight profile it is already too late for the other party to intercept.
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Good god, is it 2010??
We're already in the middle of the 2020s now, and the next generation/6th generation fighters are going to emerge in prototype form in the second half of this decade for service in the 2030s.
The technology base -- propulsion, structure, airframe design -- for a frontline combat aircraft intended to enter service around 2030s, to operate in the true hypersonic regime, just doesn't exist that we know of.
Talking wildly about the idea of hypersonic fighter aircraft fifteen years ago, for fighter aircraft expected in the 2030s, was okay.
But we're less than 10 years away from that time period now, and if hypersonic performance is expected, then we would see a much more mature technology base for it by now. Unless the major aerospace powers are all secretly pursuing hypersonic performance and hiding technology and industry advancements relating to it, or unless there is new gamechanging news which emerges, I think we can pretty much dismiss the idea of genuine hypersonic performance as an expectation for the next generation of fighter aircraft expected for the 2030s.
In that case 6th gen does not seem too much of an advancement over what we already have now, more like 5+ gen.
Unfortunately, the "generation system" doesn't always mean that there are major differences in capability between "generations" like there was between 4th and 5th generation.
We can't just project hopes or expectations about fancy new capabilities for the next generation to justify a new numerical "generation".
If it makes people feel better, instead of calling it "6th generation" maybe "new generation" or "next generation" would be more appropriate.
It seems that the advantages 5th gen had over the previous gen dwarfed the difference between any other two successive generations.
Possibly the difference between next gen and 5th gen would be more like difference say between 4th and 3rd.
lcloo
Captain
My two cents: I see that the future generation of fighter jet will be extremely smart rather than having higher speed and heavier weapon load than current generation. AI is definitely a main feature, stealth, endurance, environment awareness and self-defense will be enhanced too.
One impression I wish the next gen fighter jet will have is that when the pilot is unconscious, the aircraft would automatically fly back to base, and AI will check up pilot's injury condition, eject munition that might endanger the landing and send the data to control tower before landing.
Another would be the aircraft has realtime data feed from satellites, AWACS, ground forces, weather station etc, and the AI would process the info and pass a solution to the pilot.
One impression I wish the next gen fighter jet will have is that when the pilot is unconscious, the aircraft would automatically fly back to base, and AI will check up pilot's injury condition, eject munition that might endanger the landing and send the data to control tower before landing.
Another would be the aircraft has realtime data feed from satellites, AWACS, ground forces, weather station etc, and the AI would process the info and pass a solution to the pilot.
broadsword
Brigadier
Even without those input data, the AI would formulate the most optimum solutions to the pilot or the navigation guidance.