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xiabonan

Junior Member
I hope some understand that for Britain to even TRY to interfere in ANY way in HK matters is a very sensitive issue to most Chinese people. Hence so far Chinese government's response has been very restrained and rational, I would say.

You'll only end up angering them all and turn even angrier towards the OC movement, and see them as traitors.

There's no logic in this, there's no discussion in this, there's no rationality in this--pretty much like how the Chinese would respond to Japanese provocations.

There are just some events, or incidents, that leave a permanent mark on an entire nation, that once it was left there, it could not be erased, but only slightly eroded away by time. But any time anyone tries to peel off the scar and bring up the matter again, it will deepen, and it will never heal.

If the British MPs really want anything good for the OC people and the people of HK in general, stay out of this. The more these guys try to interfere, the more nationalistic and more provoked and angrier the mainland Chinese people will become. Right now most mainlanders still recognise that the OC people do not represent the whole of HK's population.

Let me tell you something, there are MANY--and by MANY I really mean it--people in China who would rather let HK rot and die than to see British interfering in HK matters again.
 
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pla101prc

Senior Member
superdog said:
The problem is exactly that. For a long time people have been trained by dominant ideologies to believe that a more direct election equals better (real?) democracy equals a better future for Hong Kong. However, more and more people nowadays began to question the validity of such a belief as things like irrationalities in the OC movement forces them to reconsider the complexity of the real world, where "a magic button for real democracy" does not exist literally or metaphorically (e.g. a certain form of election). You're right that people don't just "forget" they desire change and wants democracy, but it is realizations like this that is causing the OC movement to lose support at the most fundamental level.

Unfortunately, for the relatively naive young protesters, this level of understanding is difficult to achieve. Instead they tend to think those who do not share their belief as simply being afraid of repercussions.
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i wonder what that scholarism kid is thinking right now, if deep down he is willing to admit that he has been soundly defeated...even though it was a forgone conclusion for many on this forum almost since the onset of this movement. the increasing proclivity towards violence is also something that many of us had stated as a real possibility. and i am not sorry that it is happening because it means we are finally approaching the end game of this fiasco. the only question now is how HK government will end this, and how it will deal with the movement leaders.

either way i think the big bosses in beijing are laughing pretty hard at this situation, it was an outcome that was probably better than their most optimistic expectations. those kids really overplayed their hands, by a long stretch...
 
shen

shen

Senior Member
It is interesting how this protest movement is so differently received by the Chinese people compare to 1989. Back then, there were genuine widespread sympathy for the students protesters across the population from party insiders, to workers and intellectuals. Now almost everybody hate them. What is different? What changed?
Is there a leader like Szeto Wah among the HK opposition today? Now there is man who although not a friend of Beijing, is also not a puppet of colonial powers.

xiabonan said:
I hope some understand that for Britain to even TRY to interfere in ANY way in HK matters is a very sensitive issue to most Chinese people. Hence so far Chinese government's response has been very restrained and rational, I would say.

You'll only end up angering them all and turn even angrier towards the OC movement, and see them as traitors.

There's no logic in this, there's no discussion in this, there's no rationality in this--pretty much like how the Chinese would respond to Japanese provocations.

There are just some events, or incidents, that leave a permanent mark on an entire nation, that once it was left there, it could not be erased, but only slightly eroded away by time. But any time anyone tries to peel off the scar and bring up the matter again, it will deepen, and it will never heal.

If the British MPs really want anything good for the OC people and the people of HK in general, stay out of this. The more these guys try to interfere, the more nationalistic and more provoked and angrier the mainland Chinese people will become. Right now most mainlanders still recognise that the OC people do not represent the whole of HK's population.

Let me tell you something, there are MANY--and by MANY I really mean it--people in China who would rather let HK rot and die than to see British interfering in HK matters again.
Click to expand...
 
AssassinsMace

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
It's because these activists tried to create a separate identity from the start based on pawning off the ugly stereotypes of Chinese in general as the only difference. It wasn't about democracy then. That's just the excuse to get Western support. When one brands the majority in an ugly way especially when they're guilty of it too, the majority tends not to be sympathetic. It's pretty arrogant to expect people they look down at to wonder why they aren't getting their support. That's the sociopathic mentality you see in elitists. They should know more than anyone else where Hong Kong martial arts movies on numerous occasions portrayed the traitorous Chinese individual that always sides with the foreign power at the expense of other Chinese. That's what happening here but not on an individual basis. And it's these people that always perpetuate the stereotypes the most. Just look at that Joshua Wong kid. All he needs is to show his buck teeth and he's every racist caricature depicting Asians. Put on a Chinese peasant outfit or a WWII Japanese military uniform and you literally can't tell the difference.
 
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counterprime

New Member
Registered Member
AssassinsMace said:
perpetuate the stereotypes the most. Just look at that Joshua Wong kid. All he needs is to show his buck teeth and he's every racist caricature depicting Asians.
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This is going to sound crazy, but I can't shake off this feeling that this ultra dweeb, Joshua Wong, was handpicked by racist westerners to represent Asians.
 
AssassinsMace

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
counterprime said:
This is going to sound crazy, but I can't shake off this feeling that this ultra dweeb, Joshua Wong, was handpicked by racist westerners to represent Asians.
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It's the method of operation of the self-haters. They regularly perpetuate stereotypes to confirm them for their masters so they don't feel like they're wrong. They're the yes men who will never tell their masters, "No!" You never saw these types of protests when the British ruled with no democracy and now the British feel no guilt because these activists have laid the blame for no democracy on China.
 
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wtlh

wtlh

Junior Member
MwRYum said:
Perhaps Beijing should announce that a few of the deals signed earlier this year will be suspended or even forfeited outright, so "to get the message across"? Now that'd be interesting.

And the prince's visit to China next year? There won't be any love lost if it is cancelled, thanks to his dad soured the whole thing way back.
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That is why it is William who will be representing the Head of the State for the visit, rather than his dad. And China only invited William not his dad. LOL.

In terms of the deals. It is unlikely that Beijing will suspend or forfeit them at this stage, given that Chinese companies are the ones to make gains in the deals, and that UK is one of the major Western economies where China has broken through many of the protectionist/paranoia barriers in some of the key infrastructure projects.
 
superdog

superdog

Junior Member
I don't like those OC "leaders" one bit, but I think there are better things to discuss than matching them with racist stereotypes. Attack the problem, not the person, right？
 
MwRYum

MwRYum

Major
pla101prc said:
i wonder what that scholarism kid is thinking right now, if deep down he is willing to admit that he has been soundly defeated...even though it was a forgone conclusion for many on this forum almost since the onset of this movement. the increasing proclivity towards violence is also something that many of us had stated as a real possibility. and i am not sorry that it is happening because it means we are finally approaching the end game of this fiasco. the only question now is how HK government will end this, and how it will deal with the movement leaders.

either way i think the big bosses in beijing are laughing pretty hard at this situation, it was an outcome that was probably better than their most optimistic expectations. those kids really overplayed their hands, by a long stretch...
Click to expand...

Probably that coveted(?) "Time Magazine Person of The Year 2014" title, and Nobel Peace Price not so far down the pipeline, which to him it's all within reach now...and running out of tricks, now playing that old hunger strike card, but seriously you would never find him in any mortal danger from starved to death, as hunger strike in HK is something like this:

10422552_841665662541474_2097698666377557247_n.jpg


Laughable, eh?

The only game changer now available to them, would be to wear suicide vest packed with C4 and throw themselves at the PLA Garrison HQ just opposite the GovHQ, since they don't dare to set themselves on fire, y'know.
 
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wtlh

wtlh

Junior Member
xiabonan said:
If the British MPs really want anything good for the OC people and the people of HK in general ....
Click to expand...

I do not think that was their goal. That group also consisted of some formal HK officials. Their aim is to regain some influence in HK politics in anyway possible. Old dreams do not die easy. And they have been trying their luck on this one even though it is obvious that it is a long shot. Also, these MPs and lobbyists do not have that much connection with business ties to China, and thus Sino-British relations is not really one of their concerns. It is up to David Cameron to rein them in, and balance things out before real damage is done.

There is absolutely no way China is going to let them in. It is like letting the ex of your spouse (who still has not given up on her) come in your house to visit her when you are having a domestic row.
 
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