News on China's scientific and technological development.

machupicu

Junior Member
Registered Member
The US microchips industry has become increasingly anxious over the White House's reckless ban on Huawei Technologies, a major client for many American technology manufacturers, which worry about lost sales and an inevitable decline in their competence in the coming years.

A key feature of the microchips industry is that it is relying on digital devices makers to consume the chips, without which chip producers cannot achieve economies of scale and make a profit to support research and development, industry analysts said.

China is the largest chip consumer in the world, with a market scale equal to the total of the US, EU and Japan combined. In the first half of 2020, the rev-enue of China's chip industry rose 16.1 percent to reach 353.9 billion yuan ($51.46 billion). The full-year figure is likely to reach 876.6 billion yuan, ac-cording to data released at the second World Semiconductor Conference, held from Wednesday to Friday.

In addition to boosting the local chip industry, China has also ramped up im-ports to meet growing domestic demand. Wei Shaojun, a microelectronics and nano-electronics professor at Tsinghua University, said that China's chip imports in 2020 are expected to exceed $300 billion for the third consecutive year.

6f3453a0-a827-4156-832a-403ed93525c8.jpeg

Graphics: GT



Geng Bo, deputy secretary-general of the China Solid State Lighting Alliance, a semiconductor industry association, told the Global Times Thursday that robust demand from Chinese high-tech firms and the vast consumer market have supported the growth of US chipmakers - not only financially but also in terms of feedback and data for their progress.

"Huawei has witnessed rapid growth in its customer-oriented products in re-cent years from smartphones to pads with state-of-the-art technologies, which helped boost the whole microchips industry," said Geng.

Continuation of the bilateral conflict could jeopardize US semiconductor companies' ability to do business in China on an equal footing with their competitors and could dent the estimated $49 billion of revenue that the US semiconductor industry derived from Chinese device manufacturers, according to a Boston Consulting Group report in March.

SEMI, the industry association serving the global electronics design and manufacturing supply chain, released a statement Monday saying the US Commerce Department's decision to significantly expand unilateral restrictions will likely lead to more lost sales, eroding the customer base for US-origin items.

"The new restrictions will also fuel a perception that the supply of US technology is unreliable and lead non-US customers to call for the design-out of US technology. Meanwhile, these actions further incentivize efforts to supplant these U.S. technologies," read the statement.

Previously, Qualcomm was reportedly lobbying the US government to allow it to sell chips to Huawei.

"Qualcomm has a mixed stance on the Huawei ban," Bryan Wong, principal researcher at the Suning Institute of Finance in Nanjing, East China's Jiangsu Province, told the Global Times on Thursday.

The US chipmaker might gain from the ban due to some areas of rivalry with Huawei. But there could be negative side effects for Qualcomm, Wong said, in terms of market response. "Many smartphone vendors like Xiaomi use Qualcomm chips, so if Qualcomm suspends chip supplies, it will lead domestic manufacturers to believe that the US company is unreliable as a supplier," Wong stated.

Concerns are already showing up in Qualcomm's sliding market share and profits in the Chinese market. Chinese market accounted for about 65 percent of the US firm's revenue, according to Wong.

Ma Jihua, a veteran industry analyst, warned of a slowdown in the develop-ment of the global chip industry, from research and development (R&D) to investment to chip manufacturing...

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
China's made some progress, but it's not enough. According to the most recent estimates, the United States spends 17% and China spends 6% of its annual R&D funds on basic research. That amounts to the United States ($86 billion) and China ($19 billion). in a recent year.

Source:
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

China is already decades behind on basic research than the U.S. But it only spends a fraction of what the U.S. does on basic research per year. Thus not only is it behind, but it is falling further and further behind every year.
Look at the number of personnel, not the dollar amount.
 

machupicu

Junior Member
Registered Member
Look at the number of personnel, not the dollar amount.
Yes, China leads US by over 500,000 for Ph.D-level R&D personnel (2M vs 1.5M), which explains why CN is ahead of the US in many fields.

You can extrapolate from the data below,
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

But then ppl in the US would say the quality is not the same LOL, but their logic doesn't make sense because China has many top universities plus post grads from overseas universities,too. For example, CAS (Ch Ac of Sci) has over 65,000 members, and 80% of them have post grads degrees from overseas, only as bonus points though.
CAS with over 110 research institutions, is itself the Largest research org in the world, Harvard U is 2nd.
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
Yes, China leads US by over 500,000 for Ph.D-level R&D personnel (2M vs 1.5M), which explains why CN is ahead of the US in many fields.

You can extrapolate from the data below,
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

But then ppl in the US would say the quality is not the same LOL, but their logic doesn't make sense because China has many top universities plus post grads from overseas universities,too. For example, CAS (Ch Ac of Sci) has over 65,000 members, and 80% of them have post grads degrees from overseas, only as bonus points though.
CAS with over 110 research institutions, is itself the Largest research org in the world, Harvard U is 2nd.

At scale the innovation game is actually really straightforward. Technical development is ultimately a game of permutations and iterations. For any one set of problems there are a bounded number of ways one can arrange the component elements and forces of the universe towards a solution. The more people you have working on a problem the more permutations and iterations you can go through, and the faster you can arrive at and then optimize a solution. The more knowledge, skill, and intelligence each person has on average the faster and more efficiently you can navigate the potential solution space. Likewise with more available and better tools, more efficient work processes, etc. If you’re coming from behind, you can try to copy previous solutions to the best of your abilities, insofar as that information is available, to try to bootstrap a shortcut. When you can help it there’s no need to reinvent the wheel.

When we compare China with the US there’s always an emphasis on “quality” via a comparison of each country’s top educational institutions, but the talent that comes out of top institutions is a drop in the bucket for any country’s R&D manpower. If we care about quality we should be looking at the quality of talent coming out of the middle tier STEM programs for each country just as much. Anyone who’s lived in the US can tell you the quality of middle tier institutions between China and the US are actually not too different, but the quantity of STEM talent China turns out from middle tier schools is much higher than the US’s. Then consider how much of the STEM student body in top tier schools (both undergrad and postgrad) in the US are international, and more specifically from China. That’s right, insofar as the US has a lead in top institutions, the actual contribution to R&D potential those institutions generate are *shared* internationally, not exclusively held by the US. This is in part because of US visa policies and job availability, in part because at least in US academia the commitment to global openness has traditionally been quite genuine because there’s a recognition that getting the best talent in the world is a strength, and in part because they can make more money off international students.

So in terms of the basic ability to generate competitive if not superlative R&D output, China is not lacking in the manpower department, in either raw talent or total capacity, and it’s more or less been closing the gap in the tools and work process picture. Dollars spent is only at best a rough proxy for the real fundamental forces that drive R&D output, and only guys who’s understanding of R&D is as inscrutable magic sauce try to understand R&D via financial proxy, and make a big deal out of how much money is spent in exclusion of all other factors.
 
Last edited:

machupicu

Junior Member
Registered Member
Can India Achieve Self Reliance In Semiconductor Manufacturing

The semiconductor industry has become a strategic sector and has a tremendous economic impact. But India lags behind in semiconductor manufacturing compared to other developed countries. Many experts have said that India needs to design and manufacture critical components involved in storage and processing, and this is important for our national security.

The electronics and semiconductor requirements for various sectors including defence, IT, manufacturing is critical for the future of India’s economy, but we are totally dependent on imports as of now...

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

machupicu

Junior Member
Registered Member
Business models weaken China's semiconductor sector: Experts

Too much dependence on a business model that separates chip design, manufacturing and packaging process may hurt China's semiconductor sector in a long run, an industry expert al said at the World Semiconductor Conference that opened in Nanjing, east China's Jiangsu Province on Wednesday.

As the world largest chip importer, China has bought hundreds of billions of dollars worth of chips overseas since 2013. But the industry still relies heavily on foreign high-end chip products, said Wei Shaojun, vice-chairman of the China Semiconductor Industry Association.

If the Chinese industry cannot get rid of the current business model, it will be very hard for it to catch up with its competitors, he added.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

emblem21

Major
Registered Member
Can India Achieve Self Reliance In Semiconductor Manufacturing

The semiconductor industry has become a strategic sector and has a tremendous economic impact. But India lags behind in semiconductor manufacturing compared to other developed countries. Many experts have said that India needs to design and manufacture critical components involved in storage and processing, and this is important for our national security.

The electronics and semiconductor requirements for various sectors including defence, IT, manufacturing is critical for the future of India’s economy, but we are totally dependent on imports as of now...

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
I don’t think India can ever catch up in regards to super conductor chips, they are already having to rely on foreign imports of fighter planes (some of which may be second hand trash from France), how on earth can they even try to make super conductor chips, they do t even have the money to begin such a process
 

daifo

Major
Registered Member
I don’t think India can ever catch up in regards to super conductor chips, they are already having to rely on foreign imports of fighter planes (some of which may be second hand trash from France), how on earth can they even try to make super conductor chips, they do t even have the money to begin such a process

90% of India news sites lies in a way that would make fox news blush
 

galvatron

Junior Member
Registered Member
Can India Achieve Self Reliance In Semiconductor Manufacturing

The semiconductor industry has become a strategic sector and has a tremendous economic impact. But India lags behind in semiconductor manufacturing compared to other developed countries. Many experts have said that India needs to design and manufacture critical components involved in storage and processing, and this is important for our national security.

The electronics and semiconductor requirements for various sectors including defence, IT, manufacturing is critical for the future of India’s economy, but we are totally dependent on imports as of now...

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
India is potentially another source of concern for the US, as they are going to challenge the US lead in chips.
 
Top