*New J-10 Thread*

[MIGleader]

Like the f-15, we may see the j-xx have different configurations. One config, probably the stealthiest, will be dedicated air superiority. Other, less stealthy configurations would be optimized for ground attack/sea attack.

 

[Totoro]

I seem to have been misunderstood. I wrote of next gen single engine fighter to replace j10, not the jxx twin engine fighter. What i mean is that china, if it is to catch up with US, can not afford to have 30 year long production life cycles for their current & new airplanes. Even though j10 is very new, its successor must be in works so its production could start in the 2020-2025 period. Then we'd have the jxx being supplemented by single engined baby-jxx derivative. Some will say money isn't there for that, i'd say there must be money for that. Slow down PLA development, PLAN development if needed, achieving air superiority or at least fully denying your opponent of air superiority is absolute key in modern large scale warfare.

 

[unknauthr]

Three major reasons for that.

1. Slammers weren't available to the Vipers yet.
2. Albinos couldn't move mud whereas Vipers were great at moving mud.
3. The Eagle Mafia (which really caused the first two and a slew of other "deficiencies" for non-Eagle fighters).

During the 1991 Gulf War the F-15 was the only airplane, USAF or otherwise that was cleared for BVR intercepts. This was because only the Eagle had the necessary hostile IFF hardware that could identify targets that did not respond to a friendly IFF query. Not even the F-14 had such a capability. This was a requirement, if they wanted to avoid fratricide.

It was therefore no accident that the F-15C took down the vast majority of enemy fighters in '91. This situation, however, is little changed today. It would be highly unlikely that the F-16C or F-18C would be cleared for BVR intercepts in a future conflict.

If China insists on having the J-XX being a dedicated air superiority fighter, their thinking is absolete and they will be wasting a lot of resources.

If the J-XX is really intended to supercede the Su-27, then it will be designed as primarily an air-to-air platform with a secondary air-to-ground capability. This is not unlike the F-22, which has only a token air-to-ground role.

 

[PakTopGun]

Whats the status on the J-10 deal to Pakistan.. when will production start? will there be co-production in Pakistan as there is being done with the J-10 as Pakistan and China have turned out to be a great team when jointly developing and producing military hardware. Cant find any more updates since the Pakistani Cabinet approved their initial purchase....:coffee:

 

[tphuang]

Whats the status on the J-10 deal to Pakistan.. when will production start? will there be co-production in Pakistan as there is being done with the J-10 as Pakistan and China have turned out to be a great team when jointly developing and producing military hardware. Cant find any more updates since the Pakistani Cabinet approved their initial purchase....:coffee:

well, we've only heard that Pakistan wants to purchase it. We know that China wants to export to J-10 at some time in the near future, since they showed Pakistan J-10. So, it's just left to the two sides to complete the deal. Like, which version of J-10 does Pakistan get and the sensors to be used and so on. There is a lot of details to be worked out. And with the F-16s and JF-17s coming into PAF in the next few years, J-10 might take a while to be inducted.

 

[skyhawk2005]

Whats the status on the J-10 deal to Pakistan.. when will production start? will there be co-production in Pakistan as there is being done with the J-10 as Pakistan and China have turned out to be a great team when jointly developing and producing military hardware. Cant find any more updates since the Pakistani Cabinet approved their initial purchase....:coffee:

You Pakistanese are pretty funny. Everything with you is co-production this, co-production that. And you write as though China NEEDED Pakistan to develop the JF17/FC1. Such comments rankles the nerves of many Chinese including mine because such comments reeks of falseness. And when I read further that Pakistan SHOULD join in with the JXX program, and co-invest, the audacity of these Pakistan posters is comical/insane. Talk about delusions!

I don't understand myself, why China greatly values it's relationship with Pakistan. Sorry if that offends, but it seems to me that IF all the things Pakistanese have been saying on their forums come to pass, it will be very strange, and questionable.

Such things like:

1> Co-Production/Sale of J10s to Pakistan in the near future.
2> Sale of JXX in the near future.
3> Transfer of WS13 tech to Pakistan.


I don't understand why Pakistan is so important to China? But if these things come to pass, then the leadership of China deems Pakistan to be a pricessless important ally of no comparison.

I still think that this is not so.

Pakistan will get J10 eventually but this is decades later. Once China's JXX is finished OR an advanced version of J10 such as the super J10 is finished, then I believe J10 will be available to Pakistan and to the world.

I think Pakistanese members on various forums overstate the willingness of China to share technology.

Lately, China follows the US model of exports. To have a superior domestic version, and to also have an inferior export version. I don't believe China will give anyone the best, cutting edge tech, even to Pakistan.

For instance, Pakistan received the best J7 variant even before China received hers. But J7 was not the best plane China had. The J8II was the most advanced aircraft.

This is also true of AEW planes. The KJ2000 represents the best AEW plane that is meant for domestic consumption. The KJ200 is the export AEW.

I get a little irritated by the attitudes of Pakistanese. Sorry but they show zero respect in assuming this, and that.

 

[maglomanic]

You Pakistanese are pretty funny.

First it's Pakistani and not Paksitanese. No wonder you don't understand alot about Sino/Pak relationship.

Everything with you is co-production this, co-production that. And you write as though China NEEDED Pakistan to develop the JF17/FC1. Such comments rankles the nerves of many Chinese including mine because such comments reeks of falseness. And when I read further that Pakistan SHOULD join in with the JXX program, and co-invest, the audacity of these Pakistan posters is comical/insane. Talk about delusions!

I do agree alot of kids say stuff like that without knowing what it really means in essence. In the same vain alot of western based chinese kids feel cheated with all that. Just take the above paragraph, it sounds like your deepest wish that things go sour between the two countries.

Fortunately policies are made by more mature people than 'kids' from both sides. If you are outraged at audacity of Pakistanis asking for stuff then sadly there is more in store for you.

It's not like China is binded to Pakistan and is helpless about it. China has it's interests in Pakistan. Strategic location of Pakistan, same stance vis-a-vis India (a competitor to China), Standing among muslim countries and now the need for a Port that brings in Oil from a very shorter route and develops western China.

I don't understand myself, why China greatly values it's relationship with Pakistan. Sorry if that offends, but it seems to me that IF all the things Pakistanese have been saying on their forums come to pass, it will be very strange, and questionable.

Such things like:

1> Co-Production/Sale of J10s to Pakistan in the near future.
2> Sale of JXX in the near future.
3> Transfer of WS13 tech to Pakistan.

I understand you are hurt! i appologize for all the childish rants that have made you feel cheated. But if you objectively look at things things are gonna get warmed up even more between two countries, for the reasons i gave. I hardly see any problem with Pakistan getting the next gen fighter from China.Maybe all of us should bow down and pay you homage for that so that you don't feel cheated.

I don't understand why Pakistan is so important to China? But if these things come to pass, then the leadership of China deems Pakistan to be a pricessless important ally of no comparison.

I still think that this is not so.

Yes it is not so. It's called mutual benefit realtionship. For you the only priceless thing is J-XX and when it's first photo comes out. For the leadership in China it's energy resources in middle east and development of western china. Empathize!

I get a little irritated by the attitudes of Pakistanese. Sorry but they show zero respect in assuming this, and that.

Once again i am sorry. They get overzealous i have to admit. Would you beleive we have to write page long essays in school on sino/pak relationship? It's ingrained in the mind of every Pakistani to the point where they take it for granted. Which is obviously wrong in international politics. But the way things are going, it will be the case(close realtionship) for long time to come even if you don't like it.

Also, just like you get annoyed with the rants of 'Pakistanese' i get very annoyed when some chinese kid tries to portray China based on 'western doctorine' and 'export model'. China is modernizing no doubt about it, but they are trying to get good practices and technology anywhere they get it from not adopting to 'westernization' for the sake of it. They still have other priorities which are opposite to western doctrines and 'standards'.

 

[maglomanic]

Whats the status on the J-10 deal to Pakistan.. when will production start? will there be co-production in Pakistan as there is being done with the J-10 as Pakistan and China have turned out to be a great team when jointly developing and producing military hardware. Cant find any more updates since the Pakistani Cabinet approved their initial purchase....:coffee:

I have to say this, if there were any prizes for most fruitless, unproductive and void of any matter posts, i 'll give you for first, second and third position. Not a single post that you have made makes use of a very common trait among human beings called common sense.

It has come to the point i have started shuning every topic in which you post.

and yes how can we forget this------->:coffee:

 

[coolieno99]

I don't understand myself, why China greatly values it's relationship with Pakistan.

China has very good relations with Muslim countries in general. And Pakistan is the most powerful Muslim country, militarily wise. China needs as many allies as possible, otherwise the U.S. will just squeeze it like a vise(it's called containment).

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

 

[Gollevainen]

Now This thread will be closed if this flaming continues. You have obinions? Express them in manners that are not provocative and offensive or othervise you are found guilty on flaming...Warnings are issued:nono: :nono:


Gollevainen