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BoraTas

BoraTas

Captain
Registered Member
Even on this forum I was called hysteric when I told this was coming. Post-Covid hate of the Chinese got normalized. Chinese immigration to the USA is not substantial in 2024, both legal and illegal. It is happening in numbers that are inconsequential to both countries. In fact there is a reverse flow if you look at highly educated Chinese. Increased illegal entry is just a part of the global fad and the Chinese entries are incomparably lower than South American and Indian entries.

Still, the entering bunch is being painted as terrorists and CCP agents by the GOP media, when they are ironically more likely to be liberals. The media never even mentions the numbers. Even the other side of the political spectrum is complicit with this as evidenced by ongoing crackdowns in the academia. Bad things can happen.

immigrants.png
 
S

Serb

Junior Member
Registered Member
Phead128 said:
Welcome to the real world, where you can't take any politicians (Western or Chinese) too seriously, or else you will be disappointed. Heck, we will be in WW3 already if we took every slight over Taiwan too seriously, but the clear redlines 1) no nukes, 2) no US bases, 3) no formal independence are the main one to worry about. Everything else is a distraction, like Pelosi visit, trainers, arms sales, etc..
Click to expand...


If Pelosi's visit were kind of irrelevant or a "distraction" as you say, then you wouldn't have all those PLA exercises afterward as a response.

Nor would you have constant military maneuvers around Taiwan if Taiwan's recent rhetoric, US arms sales, etc, were also "distractions".

What would you say the same when Biden or Trump visited the island after the following elections in the US for example? Is it also a "distraction"?

If you had those exercises after Pelosi's visit failing to deter, then what would happen during Kamala Harris's or Biden's visit, what would be the next step for China to respond with?

Could the US "interpret" that response for China as enough to warrant their own military "protection" of Taiwan, as Biden said they would do?

There is a point when something becomes too much. It's not that point yet, but it's sure coming soon. You people are way too casual.

By this point, it's way more likely that a war over Taiwan between China and the US would break out in this decade than it won't.

In a world where all this is going in Ukraine, and the Middle East, it sounds very likely that something around Taiwan would also break out.

As we see the US is not backing down from anything and they made it clear with their actions. They are just waiting for their elections to finish.

They secured Lao's victory in Taiwan, just after the US presidential elections finish you will see a new exponential increase in provocations.
 
H

HereToSeePics

Junior Member
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Registered Member
Randomuser said:
Yeah see that's the problem. China already invested a lot more in Vietnam earlier than the west did since they were too busy getting scammed by Modi...

Maybe the guys on wall street know which horses to pick but the guys in DC sure as hell don't.
Click to expand...

The United States’s biggest fallacy is treating manufacturing (and moving it out of China) as a zero sum game and completely ignoring the classic idiom of “the whole being greater than the sum of its parts”. Its assuming that every dollar of goods purchased from Vietnam or Mexico is a dollar less going to China when the reality is the long term regional economic improvements benefits China.

When manufacturers move low and medium value consumer goods (clothes, toys, home decor) to developing countries like Vietnam, Indonesia, Mexico, etc, it builds up wealth and purchasing power of their workers economy of those countries. Those consumers now have money to buy high value products, industrial infrastructure and white goods(smart phones, televisions, washers/driers, EVs, etc) from China who continues to dominate at producing.

You don’t try to trip up China’s manufacturing economy by building up the manufacturing economy of China’s manufacturing partners.
 
ficker22

ficker22

Senior Member
Registered Member
BoraTas said:
Even on this forum I was called hysteric when I told this was coming. Post-Covid hate of the Chinese got normalized. Chinese immigration to the USA is not substantial in 2024, both legal and illegal. It is happening in numbers that are inconsequential to both countries. In fact there is a reverse flow if you look at highly educated Chinese. Increased illegal entry is just a part of the global fad and the Chinese entries are incomparably lower than South American and Indian entries.

Still, the entering bunch is being painted as terrorists and CCP agents by the GOP media, when they are ironically more likely to be liberals. The media never even mentions the numbers. Even the other side of the political spectrum is complicit with this as evidenced by ongoing crackdowns in the academia. Bad things can happen.

View attachment 125044
Click to expand...
Just waiting for Europe to fully jump on the Bandwagon and start alienising their Asian/Chinese Populace
 
C

chgough34

Junior Member
Registered Member
manqiangrexue said:
Wait, do you even know what you're talking about? The cost to the US from watching the PRC take over the ROC is the total loss of confidence in American power in Asia.
Click to expand...
“Asia” being effectively just two countries: Japan and South Korea; neither of which is particularly important to the United States
manqiangrexue said:
This will herald to the world that America's will in Asia is supplanted by China's.
Click to expand...
Which countries are this “world”? Europe and FVEY will stick with the U.S. until the end of all time and developing world countries deal based in transactions of coercion and inducement. And even if America’s will in Asia can’t be effectuated -> so what?
manqiangrexue said:
So if they've decided that they cannot successfully militarily intervene and just have to watch this happen, the "popcorn" they'll be eating will probably be harder to swallow than if they were dingleberry flavored.
Click to expand...
See above. The stakes aren’t high for the U.S. since the 3 biggest reasons cited for Taiwan: “credibility”, “Asia” and “democracy” are fairly analytically vaucous
 
S

supersnoop

Major
Registered Member
HereToSeePics said:
The United States’s biggest fallacy is treating manufacturing (and moving it out of China) as a zero sum game and completely ignoring the classic idiom of “the whole being greater than the sum of its parts”. Its assuming that every dollar of goods purchased from Vietnam or Mexico is a dollar less going to China when the reality is the long term regional economic improvements benefits China.

When manufacturers move low and medium value consumer goods (clothes, toys, home decor) to developing countries like Vietnam, Indonesia, Mexico, etc, it builds up wealth and purchasing power of their workers economy of those countries. Those consumers now have money to buy high value products, industrial infrastructure and white goods(smart phones, televisions, washers/driers, EVs, etc) from China who continues to dominate at producing.

You don’t try to trip up China’s manufacturing economy by building up the manufacturing economy of China’s manufacturing partners.
Click to expand...

Also they are purchasing Chinese services and equipment to build up these factories.

Genius-level moves from those politicians
 
M

montyp165

Senior Member
Serb said:
If Pelosi's visit were kind of irrelevant or a "distraction" as you say, then you wouldn't have all those PLA exercises afterward as a response.

Nor would you have constant military maneuvers around Taiwan if Taiwan's recent rhetoric, US arms sales, etc, were also "distractions".

What would you say the same when Biden or Trump visited the island after the following elections in the US for example? Is it also a "distraction"?

If you had those exercises after Pelosi's visit failing to deter, then what would happen during Kamala Harris's or Biden's visit, what would be the next step for China to respond with?

Could the US "interpret" that response for China as enough to warrant their own military "protection" of Taiwan, as Biden said they would do?

There is a point when something becomes too much. It's not that point yet, but it's sure coming soon. You people are way too casual.

By this point, it's way more likely that a war over Taiwan between China and the US would break out in this decade than it won't.

In a world where all this is going in Ukraine, and the Middle East, it sounds very likely that something around Taiwan would also break out.

As we see the US is not backing down from anything and they made it clear with their actions. They are just waiting for their elections to finish.

They secured Lao's victory in Taiwan, just after the US presidential elections finish you will see a new exponential increase in provocations.
Click to expand...
My own analysis and observation is that the moment the US starts a full-scale war with China (regardless of the pretext), China will not stop until the US political order ceases to exist, and if the US tries to genocide Chinese/Asians in the US in the process, then the US itself will cease to exist. The Chinese capability to do exactly that is already mostly in place and will become more apparent in the next 18 months.
 
_killuminati_

_killuminati_

Senior Member
Registered Member
BoraTas said:
Even on this forum I was called hysteric when I told this was coming. Post-Covid hate of the Chinese got normalized.
Click to expand...
Sinophobia in America is very old. Maybe it got censored for a while and resurfaced again. Covid can be a trigger point but isn't the cause. The cause is inherent racism embedded within the
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psyche.

1862
the Anti-Coolie Act of 1862 in short, was passed by the
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in an attempt to appease rising anger among white laborers about salary competition created by the influx of
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at the height of the
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.
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1870
Another key piece of legislation was the
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, which extended citizenship rights to
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but barred Chinese from naturalization on the grounds that they and other Asians could not be assimilated into American society. Unable to become citizens, Chinese immigrants were prohibited from voting and serving on juries, and dozens of states passed
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that prohibited non-citizens from purchasing real estate, thus preventing them from establishing permanent homes and businesses.
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1871
The Los Angeles Chinese massacre of 1871 was a
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targeting Chinese immigrants in
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, United States that occurred on October 24, 1871. Approximately 500
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and
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attacked, harassed, robbed, and murdered the ethnic
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residents in what is today referred to as the
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neighborhood.
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1882
The Chinese Exclusion Act was a
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signed by President
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on May 6, 1882, prohibiting all immigration of Chinese laborers for 10 years. The law made exceptions for merchants, teachers, students, travelers, and diplomats.
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The Chinese Exclusion Act was the first major U.S. law ever implemented to prevent all members of a specific national group from immigrating to the United States
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Late 1800s
The Yellow Peril (also the Yellow Terror, the Yellow Menace and the Yellow Specter) is a
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that depicts the peoples of
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and
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as an existential danger to the
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.
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1917
The Immigration Act of 1917 (also known as the Literacy Act and less often as the Asiatic Barred Zone Act) was a
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that aimed to restrict
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by imposing literacy tests on immigrants, creating new categories of inadmissible persons, and barring immigration from the
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zone.
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1924
National Origins Act
Enacted amid increasing public and political anxiety about the country's rapid social and demographic changes, the 1924 act supplanted earlier legislation by vastly reducing immigration for countries outside the Western Hemisphere: Immigrants from Asia were banned
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Even if discriminatory laws are repealed, perceptions don't change easily. The phobias become latent, underhanded. Old habits die hard.
 
_killuminati_

_killuminati_

Senior Member
Registered Member
chgough34 said:
Which countries are this “world”? Europe and FVEY will stick with the U.S. until the end of all time and developing world countries deal based in transactions of coercion and inducement. And even if America’s will in Asia can’t be effectuated -> so what?
Click to expand...
Only WASP countries will stick with the US. They are not very fond of the Catholics (who comprise the majority of Europe), and even lesser so, the Orthodox.
 
Phead128

Phead128

Captain
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Serb said:
If Pelosi's visit were kind of irrelevant or a "distraction" as you say, then you wouldn't have all those PLA exercises afterward as a response.

Nor would you have constant military maneuvers around Taiwan if Taiwan's recent rhetoric, US arms sales, etc, were also "distractions".

What would you say the same when Biden or Trump visited the island after the following elections in the US for example? Is it also a "distraction"?

If you had those exercises after Pelosi's visit failing to deter, then what would happen during Kamala Harris's or Biden's visit, what would be the next step for China to respond with?

Could the US "interpret" that response for China as enough to warrant their own military "protection" of Taiwan, as Biden said they would do?

There is a point when something becomes too much. It's not that point yet, but it's sure coming soon. You people are way too casual.

By this point, it's way more likely that a war over Taiwan between China and the US would break out in this decade than it won't.

In a world where all this is going in Ukraine, and the Middle East, it sounds very likely that something around Taiwan would also break out.

As we see the US is not backing down from anything and they made it clear with their actions. They are just waiting for their elections to finish.

They secured Lao's victory in Taiwan, just after the US presidential elections finish you will see a new exponential increase in provocations.
Click to expand...
There were talks about escorting Pelosi's plane into Taiwan airspace with fighters, shooting down Pelosi's airplane even, yet China was cautious, smart, and proportionately to their salami slicing with its own salami slicing (routine air exercises). What I am saying is the war hyperventilation leading up to Pelosi visit was hysterical level and predictably ended without a bang.
 
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