Ladakh Flash Point
- Thread starter Mt1701d
- Start date
- Status
Anglo MO is to get a non white nation to do all the heavy lifting whilst they sit back and do the equivalent of lobbing grenades from afar. They're like the annoying camper in FPSs and want others to do the grunt work.
For eg, in europe, Anglo led NATO has Turkey to do all the heavy lifting to pure aryan whites won't have to die as much. Turks, being muslim aren't considered white, western nor european, given the difficulty in turkey joining the EU.
In the case of Asia, the Anglos are perfectly content to let any east asian nation do the grunt work, but find an especially enthusiastic sepoy janissary in the indian.
The Quad needs India to be the backbone to act as a balancer against china, otherwise the rest of the Quad gets creamed; Indias role in the Quad is to soak up Chinese bullets and missiles so they don't fall on Anglo heads.
I said it is possible he could be right about his patrols, but that doesnt mean the lac is any different
Nice find about the General's comments. It would be really interesting to see what concessions China secured from India behind the doors regarding US-India relationship and the Indo-Pacific matters
Are you sure you went through the article? I didn't mark the LAC, the article itself did.
Here it goes (despite being posted again and again) -
(I didn't make the above image or edit it. This image has been lifted as is from the article that talks about the Troop Commanders view.
That is the LAC for him).
Refer previous posts.
Last edited:
I dunno. First off, when was that statement made? Disengagement takes some time to complete. The US is a questionable source but while this is one US military figure publicly making this claim, there is every chance it is a statement made out of some political motivation. However, due to how small profile this India China confrontation is, I also doubt they care to drum it up using small little lies that most on both sides won't take much notice of.
The Indian government and military itself recognise the fact that there are ongoing "problems" as yet unsettled in Depsang, Gogra, Hot Springs. Until the Indian MoD provide the updates they said they would a month ago, we'll just have to assume the confrontation in the north western dispute is still unresolved.
The LAC at Galwan has always been at this location. Whether Brig. RJS and his soldiers had authorization to patrol past is another discussion. In general, when ten sources say something and one source says something different, that source is either lying, mistaken, or outdated.
And some members here do not understand that patrolling =! controlling. In the past both sides regularly crosse the lac to the patrols, yet those areas were not controlled. In order to control an area, that requires either direct domination through physical occupation or indeirect occupation through infrastructure building, etc. China has not captured any area previously controlled by India, even if you use the Shukla claim line. Whereas China has lost access from fingers 8-3, which it had controlled since at the latest 2000.
And yes, China has not withdrawn from forward positions at gogra Hot Springs, and Depsang yet, and niether has India. So there are still problems. Disengagemnt at Pangong took months to negotiate, these won't be done overnight.
And some members here do not understand that patrolling =! controlling. In the past both sides regularly crosse the lac to the patrols, yet those areas were not controlled. In order to control an area, that requires either direct domination through physical occupation or indeirect occupation through infrastructure building, etc. China has not captured any area previously controlled by India, even if you use the Shukla claim line. Whereas China has lost access from fingers 8-3, which it had controlled since at the latest 2000.
And yes, China has not withdrawn from forward positions at gogra Hot Springs, and Depsang yet, and niether has India. So there are still problems. Disengagemnt at Pangong took months to negotiate, these won't be done overnight.
No one has ever said patrol = control. That's you strawmanning people here.
India patrolled F3 to F8 since it has claimed F3 to F8 and the LAC is between F4 and F8 and by India's own four star's admission, India has trespassed beyond LAC more than 5 times as often as PLA for conducting patrols.
China captured F4 to F8 for a year and IA was completely useless in pushing PLA out.
If you can call China losing access to F8 to F3 then India's lost access to F3 to F8 has it not?
Now it may seem equal in "loss" to you feeble minded Jai Hinds but you have ignored two very important points.
1. China has always offered to settle this along the LAC and draw permanent, clear border somewhere between F4 and F8. Meanwhile India always insisted on getting everything up to F8. Now with this above situation, India has lost more because India wanted all of it while China wanted half or so but was happy to negotiate for settlement.
2. India patrolled and intruded more than China. This bothered China so much that PLA was sent in to occupy the entire F4 to F8 stretch which it did successfully and held for as long as the CCP wanted them to. India eventually relented and agreed it will no longer patrol F3 to F8.
1 and 2 will shift the balance of win much more towards China's direction. This isn't even considering that IA was defeated by PLA despite IA tactics in using human wave and superior numbers. They couldn't remove PLA the entire time. Then comparing the military of India and China, the difference is even wider than the difference between the Chinese military and the US. Sure India has certain logistic and numerical superiority in this region of the world but the Indians still did not shoot for the entire year the PLA occupied F4 to F8 which was traditionally more patrolled by India and claimed by India. Something China only really wanted half of or truly anything beyond F8 is fine.
REMEMBER that China has already won Aksai Chin and pushed forward in Pangong. China was always behind F8 and WELLLLLLLL behind F8 before the 1960s war.
China has won the first struggle in the 1960s and remained in control of won territory that was previously disputed.
Now India has performed salami slicing to build up and made China uncomfortable enough to use PLA and China has taken two steps forward. Given India a one step back only in return for India also taking one step back. How stupid do you idiots have to be to still not see this as clear and obvious as it already is.
Net balance:
China won huge swathes of disputed land in Aksai Chin after 1962. Controlled it (not patrol... control)
India build up and increased patrols pushed China to take another two steps forward and captured parts of Galwan/Depsang and Pangong F4 to F8. India tried tactics and failed but negotiated. India agrees to take one step back and refrain from patrols in still disputed parts in return for China taking one or two steps back. Or because it is still yet unclear what's really happening in Depsang.
Net is China major win in 20th century. Then previous status quo got shifted for variety of reasons by bilateral action.
Post status quo shift; China took two step forward and in return for taking one step back, India has to take at least one step back as well which India has agreed to and has performed. Tell me what that net is.
Bold 1: So you've finally settled on
" bu bu but he is a liar"
Good. Why beat around the bush and posture so much? A predictable cop out if there was one. Didn't disappoint.
Bold 2 : Most members do. Which members claimed China controlled? What they claim is China manged to push back India and not merely thwart it when it was offered aggression at the border.
What do you make of India not being able to patrol to points in these regions? Galwan, Gogra, Hot Springs etc.
Bold 3: China has created an agreement with India, for disengagement and buffer zone in the Y junction. That effectively pushes India back. Simple.
Bold 4: So you've finally retracted from your position that China didn't intrude into Hot Springs and Gogra and all is fine.
Improvements. I see progress and
improvement.
But the dumb as street shit Jai Hinds will only be able to see the one step back by PLA and ignore that their own military agreed and has already taken one step back themselves. At worst for China this is a neutral balance with the final result in favour for China because India now will not patrol F3 and beyond.
They will also fail to see the entire history and wider context which gives the actual win to China so convincingly it is simply too obvious to any neutral observer. Even their freaking government and military tacitly admit to this while they continue to present some Modi supa dupa winner image. It's so pathetic this is a traditional loser who just suffered one its greatest losses and humiliations but crying victory because it got thrown a half eaten meal in commiseration in return for a heavy price. But only presenting the pricey half eaten meal as if it is a deluxe free buffet. It's hilarious if it weren't so annoying that some Jai Hinds still insist on twisting truth, ignoring full picture, and spamming with random tweets from June 2020 of satellite images showing two distinctively forward position points.
They will also fail to see the entire history and wider context which gives the actual win to China so convincingly it is simply too obvious to any neutral observer. Even their freaking government and military tacitly admit to this while they continue to present some Modi supa dupa winner image. It's so pathetic this is a traditional loser who just suffered one its greatest losses and humiliations but crying victory because it got thrown a half eaten meal in commiseration in return for a heavy price. But only presenting the pricey half eaten meal as if it is a deluxe free buffet. It's hilarious if it weren't so annoying that some Jai Hinds still insist on twisting truth, ignoring full picture, and spamming with random tweets from June 2020 of satellite images showing two distinctively forward position points.
- Status