Korean War 70 years later Win Lose and A draw

Can someone detail out the Chinese artillery equipment during the Korean War?

I've read that in 1950 the mainstay of their artillery were Japanese 75mm field guns and 105mm howitzers, plus 76mm Soviet guns and US made 105mm guns captured from the ROC armies. Furthermore, they managed to capture as many as 150 US made 105mm howitzers from the retreating UN forces in 1950.

nlalyst said:

It is disrespectful to write like this. Soldiers on both sides fought bravely and are deservedly honored for their sacrifice.

I will remind you of the battle of the Chosin Reservoir. The US 7th Infantry division and the 1st Marine Division were completely surrounded by PVA forces outnumbering them 4:1, perhaps even 5:1. They suffered nearly 50% combined battle and non-battle (due to extreme weather) casualties. Yet, they kept their cohesion, broke through the encirclement and retreated in orderly fashion with most of their equipment and a stable morale. It is very rare for military units to sustain so much damage and not be broken.

Click to expand...

You want to talk about disrespect? From your statement, it looks like you only glorified the heroism of some US soldiers while conveniently ignoring what the PVA soldiers went through.

Let me remind to you that the PVA only outnumber the US forces in Korea, that's it. But the US forces dwarfs the PVA in terms of firepower. The PVA too suffered from the extreme cold and mountainous terrains. But they have to also contend with US carpet bombings, napalm bombings, strafing runs, heavy artillery barrages, superior armored forces, and naval bombardments. Not only that, PVA's supply lines are ground-only, constantly bombed, and stretched thin. PVA casualties numbered around 200k, while US casualties numbered around 36k. Despite such horrible disparity in war sacrifices, the PVA fought the UN forces to a standstill. There is just no contest when it comes to the sacrifice and heroism of the PVA.

It is so disrespectful that you use one small story of US soldier heroism to downplay the heroism and suffering of the PVA. Exchange places for once. How long do you think US soldiers morale could stand when:
1) They are in a foreign country
2) There is little artillery support.
3) Negligible armor support.
4) No air cover.
5) No naval cover.
6) Unreliable supply lines.
7) Have to endure long marches for hundreds of kilometres.
8) Witness so many comrades die because of fighting in a technologically and industrially inferior force.

However, despite their strength on paper, it is understood that Chinese artillery played a minor role in the initial months of their intervention. Two reasons were given for this:
1. difficulty of sneaking the artillery across the frozen Yalu and hiding from interdiction strikes
2. difficulty of keeping up with the speed that the UN forces were retreating

Throughout 1950, US divisions were chronically short on artillery. An example given is that of the 24th infantry division's field artillery, which had just 17 105mm and 12 155mm howitzers to cover the 32 miles of Naktong River front. In 1944 such an expanse would've been covered by 250 guns. Even in 1951, Lt Gen James Van Fleet stated that by WW2 standards, his Army's artillery was short by some 70 battalions.

To make up for this, stunning rates of fire were maintained during the Chinese offensive that opened up on 16th May 1951. Per-gun 105mm daily rate shot up to 300 rounds, the 155mm to 250, and 8-inch to 200. Six enemy divisions were crippled by this field artillery effort.

The UN continued to outifre the PVA and KPA forces until the cessation of hostilities. The final Chinese offensive in July 1953 saw their largest artillery effort of the war: 705,000 rounds were fired, including much of their remaining stock of 105mm ammo captured during the Civil War. In return, UN field artillery fired 4,711,120 rounds.

Just couldn't understand why people here still making it sound like US troops are in all sort of difficulties with shortages of this and that.

Come on, people here spend time and effect putting documentary evidence video of the war. (And Please spare us the "Chinese propoganda" tag). At least have the courtesy of watching these before writing stuff that suggest US troops was hard done by.

If you bother to look at the video, you will see that Chinese troops have to swop guns with each other form different units just to help the logistic nightmare. And even this only minimise the logistic, not eliminate it entirely.

Couple with shortage of ammunition, and the refusal from the Soviets to supply free of charge. Everthing has to be paid for with little or limited funds (China's economy is many many times smaller than the US at the time) and war producing industry.

In addition, the videos showed Chinese troops carting artillery guns by hand. No horses or mechanized unit like those of the US. And if you look real closely, you can see the Chinese soldiers didn't even have proper footwear!

Gatekeeper said:

Just couldn't understand why people here still making it sound like US troops are in all sort of difficulties with shortages of this and that.

Come on, people here spend time and effect putting documentary evidence video of the war. (And Please spare us the "Chinese propoganda" tag). At least have the courtesy of watching these before writing stuff that suggest US troops was hard done by.

If you bother to look at the video, you will see that Chinese troops have to swop guns with each other form different units just to help the logistic nightmare. And even this only minimise the logistic, not eliminate it entirely.

Couple with shortage of ammunition, and the refusal from the Soviets to supply free of charge. Everthing has to be paid for with little or limited funds (China's economy is many many times smaller than the US at the time) and war producing industry.

In addition, the videos showed Chinese troops carting artillery guns by hand. No horses or mechanized unit like those of the US. And if you look real closely, you can see the Chinese soldiers didn't even have proper footwear!

Click to expand...

Some of these US Army fanboys have watched too much Band Of Brothers or Saving Private Ryan. These are the same guys who would say that the USA defeated Nazi Germany for Europe. They would talk about the 'enormous hardship' of the Normandy landings while condemning Soviet conscript 'human waves' at Stalingrad. The US never experienced WWII anywhere near like China and the Soviet Union. Their experience of WWII is only through the eyes of GIs in Europe and the Pacific. While Soviet and Chinese civilians endured horrific atrocities like the Siege of Leningrad and the Nanjing Massacre.

If firing more artillery rounds than your enemy counts as "hardship", then I wonder what do US soldiers think about: hunger, lack of ammunition, long marches, death from above, and death from the sea? Not only that, after the war is won and done, how about returning to your homeland which is impoverished, and war-torn? US soldiers' hardship in Korea is a joke compared to what the Chinese soldiers experienced.

Some of these US Army fanboys have watched too much Band Of Brothers or Saving Private Ryan. These are the same guys who would say that the USA defeated Nazi Germany for Europe. They would talk about the 'enormous hardship' of the Normandy landings while condemning Soviet conscript 'human waves' at Stalingrad. The US never experienced WWII anywhere near like China and the Soviet Union. Their experience of WWII is only through the eyes of GIs in Europe and the Pacific. While Soviet and Chinese civilians endured horrific atrocities like the Siege of Leningrad and the Nanjing Massacre.

If firing more artillery rounds than your enemy counts as "hardship", then I wonder what do US soldiers think about: hunger, lack of ammunition, long marches, death from above, and death from the sea? Not only that, after the war is won and done, how about returning to your homeland which is impoverished, and war-torn? US soldiers' hardship in Korea is a joke compared to what the Chinese soldiers experienced.

Click to expand...

The most heavily armed and supported units ever were routed by unsupported light infantry, resulting in the longest retreat in US military history.

Other random factoid, Qian Xuesen had been held under house arrest in the states for 5 years after being removed from his job for accusations of being a Communist. It was only in 1955 that a deal was reached to extradite him to China in return for captured American pilots captured during the Korean War.

The "human wave" heroes, the myth continues. Follow the link to read the original article.


Beijing reminds US of Chinese victories ahead of an expected North Korea mutual defense treaty renewal

by
October 24, 2020


In close combat in the Korean hills, a soldier of the CPVA hurls a stick grenade. Photo: National War Memorial of Korea


Troops storm forward as a bugler sounds the assault. Chinese troops lacked radios, so made do with old, but effective signal technology. Photo: National War Memorial of Korea.


CPVA troops storm through the ambush of the US 2nd Infantry Division in ‘The Gauntlet’ at Kunu-ri Pass – the worst battlefield defeat suffered by the US Army since 1945. Photo: Courtesy Paik Sun-yeop/National War Memorial of Korea


The CPVA offensive in winter 1950 thrust UN troops into a terrible retreat from North Korea. Here, Australian troops in the UN rearguard pull out through a landscape of devastation. Photo: State Library of Victoria

Sardaukar20 said:

If firing more artillery rounds than your enemy counts as "hardship", then I wonder what do US soldiers think about: hunger, lack of ammunition, long marches, death from above, and death from the sea? Not only that, after the war is won and done, how about returning to your homeland which is impoverished, and war-torn? US soldiers' hardship in Korea is a joke compared to what the Chinese soldiers experienced.

Click to expand...

Yes laughable isn't it? Chinese firing 700,000 rounds against US (I wouldn't give it credit as the UN force) 4,700,000 is somehow an advantage! Just makes you wonder what sort of world some of our posters here live under?

@discspinner

"Qian Xuesen had been held under house arrest in the states for 5 years after being removed from his job for accusations of being a Communist. It was only in 1955 that a deal was reached to extradite him to China in return for captured American pilots captured during the Korean War."

What coincident. I just posted on Chinese scientific thread about him.

weig2000 said:

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Beijing reminds US of Chinese victories ahead of an expected North Korea mutual defense treaty renewal

by

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

October 24, 2020

View attachment 64982
In close combat in the Korean hills, a soldier of the CPVA hurls a stick grenade. Photo: National War Memorial of Korea

View attachment 64986
Troops storm forward as a bugler sounds the assault. Chinese troops lacked radios, so made do with old, but effective signal technology. Photo: National War Memorial of Korea.

View attachment 64983
CPVA troops storm through the ambush of the US 2nd Infantry Division in ‘The Gauntlet’ at Kunu-ri Pass – the worst battlefield defeat suffered by the US Army since 1945. Photo: Courtesy Paik Sun-yeop/National War Memorial of Korea

View attachment 64984
The CPVA offensive in winter 1950 thrust UN troops into a terrible retreat from North Korea. Here, Australian troops in the UN rearguard pull out through a landscape of devastation. Photo: State Library of Victoria

Click to expand...

Oh jeez. I completely forgot about that stupid rumor, along with the other dumb one in regards to the Soviets during World War 2.

Gatekeeper said:

Exactly, as I mentioned in a few post back. One US regiment have more firepower than one Chinese Corp. No doubt more rations and everything else those pampered babies demanded.

Click to expand...

50% casualties is 50% casualties: give the American troops credit where it is due.