Japan spots Chinese Warships

Dear Friends
I as a Chinese dude have great respect for all cultures including the Japanese. In fact I admire various aspects of Japanese culture. Indeed Japan ahs a very modern and capable military, i have heard great things abt them but i was rather disappointed to witness their poor strategic and tactic performance. The first although not military... was a japanese police SWAT equalvalent (can't spell) execution of a hostage rescue, from memory it ended with dead hostages.. it was very poorly executed. Another was the response to a Ming class submarine that was able to penetrate japanese defences. The response was a kongo class shooting metal boxes with its gun. The ship indeed was excellent but it also shows the lack of strategic creativity of the Japanese. Lastly the recent deployment of Japanese soldiers to Iraq also demonstrates their immaturity as combatants coz who the hell has a flag badge on the front of ur helmet, the back of ur helmet, the front of ur shirt, the back of ur shirt and on the arm. And a huge flag on the side of ur vehicles which stands out like dogsh*t. Also i remember the japanese soldiers making all these poses for the local news with their equipment. Only an inexperience military make such silly poses.

The PLA however although have not fought a war for 20yrs seems to have passed on their experience to the current generation which is demonstrated in the execution of their jobs.

Correct if i am wrong but this is just my strategic point of view.

Hmm... China seems to be on the move:



Short summary: a PLAN ship has trained its gun towards a low-flying JASDF P-3 who was taking a closer look at the ship and a bunch of other PLAN ships that also where there.

This is quite aggressive, the Japanese are a very proud people (as are the Chinese) and they probably wont tolerate that the PLAN moves around, waving with their guns, in water they think is theirs (ANY country would be upset by that...).

It is a great shame that most people from these 2 cultures have forgotten their great friendship for more than a thousand yrs. It is only during the last 200 yrs that we began to hate each other. It is much better to have Japan as a friend than an enemy. At least the majority of everyday people from these 2 cultures are not hostile to each other.

Lavi said:

Hmm... China seems to be on the move:

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Short summary: a PLAN ship has trained its gun towards a low-flying JASDF P-3 who was taking a closer look at the ship and a bunch of other PLAN ships that also where there.

This is quite aggressive, the Japanese are a very proud people (as are the Chinese) and they probably wont tolerate that the PLAN moves around, waving with their guns, in water they think is theirs (ANY country would be upset by that...).

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its gun? withc gun? an ak-630? both countries claim the waters, so both have legal rights to move force their. the chinese kade the first move

mr.c, the chinese an japanese will bnever be frinds, naot afeter ww2

IDonT said:

Point taken about strategy page. Now can you fix your ass holish problem? You are so obnoxious, if you have nothing to add do not post.

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if I have nothing to add? That's actually pretty damned funny, considering that you probably don't have an engineering background.

Japan and China being friends forever until the last 200 years? What about the Mongol/Chinese invasion attempts of 1274 and 1281? And before you start claiming that the Mongols aren't Chinese I would like to point out that that is completly the opposite to what many people stated in another thread at this forum.

Lavi said:

Japan and China being friends forever until the last 200 years? What about the Mongol/Chinese invasion attempts of 1274 and 1281? And before you start claiming that the Mongols aren't Chinese I would like to point out that that is completly the opposite to what many people stated in another thread at this forum.

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And don't forget Hideyoshi's invasion of Korea in 1500. It was Korea + China vs Japan.

Back to original topic........

I think you have all misunderstood the prescence of the Chinese Warships in the Gas Fields. This is not China threatening Japan, it is China sending a statement to the Japanese following Japanese allegations of Chinese Directional Drilling into and Gas theft from, the Energy fields on the "Japanese" side of the line.

If this ever got "hot" China and Japan would announce exclusion zones of whatever proportions, and try to Police them in such a manner that the other side has to shoot first and prefferably in Ocean they do not normally claim to control.

There can be a lot of tension and face offs without anything more than a warning shot being fired. US would not seek to get "directly" involved but would publicly re-affirm its commitment to Japanese territorial integrity.

PS China and Japan are working frantically behind the scenes to agree a joint exploration and exploitation deal for these fields. Much of this sabre rattling is just negotiaition method.

Lavi said:

Japan and China being friends forever until the last 200 years? What about the Mongol/Chinese invasion attempts of 1274 and 1281? And before you start claiming that the Mongols aren't Chinese I would like to point out that that is completly the opposite to what many people stated in another thread at this forum.

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True.. the Mongols have become part of Chinese society and all Han Chinese people admire the acheivements of Kenghis Khan and Kublai Khan. One must understand Asian history in its entirity. True the Yuan Dynasty tried to invade Japan, however it is only 7 years in a 2000 yr period.

IDonT said:

And don't forget Hideyoshi's invasion of Korea in 1500. It was Korea + China vs Japan.

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Toyotomi Hideoyoshi's invasion took place during the Seng Ku Ju Dai. He was looking for more resources to fuel his campaign against the other Diamyos. Also it was only a very short time it Our 2000 yrs of history.

MIGleader said:

mr.c, the chinese an japanese will bnever be frinds, naot afeter ww2

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They can be friends... its just a question of how.
The teacher of a young prince of the Qin Kingdom told his student "When there is mutual interest people will be friends, when people don't get into each others' way they will still be friends, when people have conflicting agendas they will become enemies".

Hideyoshi Invaded China, make no mistake about it. Korea was merely a vassal state belonging to the Chinese Emperor. The war lasted over two shogunates and ~20 years. There was no daimyo rivalry in Japan at the time. All power was consolidated and Japan wanted to march into Beijing through Korea so that Hideyoshi could crown himself emperor of the whole universe, as he knew it. It was foolish of Hideyoshi to believe that if Beijing fell, he would acquire the whole of the Chinese Empire. But he couldn't resist the chance. it is believed he negotiated secret alliances with the Manchurian tribes to the north.

The japanese believed their superiority in the use of gunpowder weapons for every soldier would assure victory. But they got held up by heavily fortified resistance in Pyongyong. ultimately the Chinese imperial navy decimated the japanese navy and the Japanese had to abandon their whole campaign. After that Japan turned inwards for the next three centuries. Their belief that expansion into China was impossible led them to isolationist policies. The shoguns feared if the masses remained armed with firearms they would loose power. Japanese gunpowdered weapons were abandoned in favor of the more aristocratic weapons of sword and bow. Japan's class system became more rigid, more caste-like.

Three hundred years later, Japan reawakened their long held dream of conquering China. In the early 1900's, they ventured forth on the belief the superiority of their military weapons would assure victory. They went considerably farther than korea, but the end was the same. since japan's defeat in WWII, Japan became a pacifist nation.

If history is any guide, it is a certainty that japan would invade China again if they sensed they had the capability. Why does japan keep picking on China? It is a matter of geography. Japan has nowhere else to go for expansion. They must go into China, through Korea. Also, Japan has traditionally been ruled by a militaristic form of govenrment (kinda like Sparta). Hopefully, Japan's current American-styled government have abandoned their expansionist attitudes. Considering the example America is currently setting, things don't look very good.