J-XX Fighter Aircraft

Re: J-xx

611/CAC, as any aircraft designer/manufacturer, always have many exciting design proposals and R&D projects. But frankly speaking, in the next 10 years, they can only crank out ONE stealth plane;and that's already a great achievement. Many even believe China's various design institutes must work together to in order to work out one stealth plane.

So, what project will 611/CAC put their best effort on?

Re: J-xx

Roger604 said:

This fighter is not supposed to be the J-14. It is not supposed to be very low observable or low observable fighter. The article says that it is an evolution of China's "export fighter" -- the FC-1/JF-17.

It would not be surprising if the PLA is more transparent about projects that are intended to be export.

As for PS.... where in the image is there a flaw that makes it clearly PS? Of course this fighter will bear similarities to others. Look at our board's history with Z-10 attack helicopter -- every single photograph that came out has been followed with accusations of it being PS and cobbled together from Comanche, Augusta, Tiger, etc.

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About PS thingy, actually it is true that before official revealation, the majority of J10 and WZ10's pictures were PSed or fake. That's a fact. The few real ones surfaced later on don't change that fact.

A simple rule of verifying these PS/rumors is:

A: intial wave of pics are 99% fake.
B: if the wave of PSed pics do not quiet down over YEARS, then there must be something real.
C: When people are really getting bored and nobody's interested in creating PSed pics, then, if something suddenly shows up, 90 percently it's real.

So, for FC1, we have heard talks about future versions. Now we have one pic showing a plane that is in a very advanced stage. This plane is said to be derived from FC1 which is still in early test flight stage. The plane just can't be real.

Whether FC1's future version can evolve to such an advanced stage remains to be seen. I am waiting for the initial wave of PSed pics. If they are not coming, then there's no smoke, let alone fire.

Re: J-xx

I can see from the article to say what you say is true, that the author is trying to convey his ideas of evolving the JF-17 into a stealth fighter. The problem is that this is typical of "fan-think" endemic with forums everywhere. You assume you can take a design and endlessly morph it like putty into some new form. Twin engined stealthy J-10s for example. Aerospace technology in reality does not work like that. These are not like toys or cars that you can evolve and morph into such degrees like Transformers and expect it to work.

With such changes, you might as well go with an all new design. It would have been more easier to develop, more cost efficient with more effective results.

Re: J-xx

These pictures came from a magazine. It's not just a random photo on a website. It's highly unlikely that a magazine would PS something to pass it off. If you read closely, the magazine's name is "Modern Weapons" 现代兵器.

If this is a PS picture, where is a flaw? It's very difficult to just cut and paste a few different aircraft together and not have it look like a nightmare.

Thirdly, FC-1 is NOT in "early test flight stage"! It's done and has been done for a long time. Only the issue with exporting Russian engines remain. Timing wise, a successor to FC-1/JF-17 (a.k.a. JF-20) would be appropriate right about now.

I stand by my assessment, this photograph is real. Unless, of course, it is a photograph of some other existing, real aircraft not Chinese. But it doesn't appear to be.

Re: J-xx

Well here's a link that compares a pic of a F-35 that's from a very similar angle. There are similarities. If it is PSed, then whoever did it seemed to work on it long enough to make differences.



There are a lot magazines with questionable pics. Chances are... fake! The problem is they haven't been really confirmed real or fake either way. We assume they're fake because nothing further has ever become evident. The WZ-10 seems to have gone through a few different working design prototypes similar or disimilar to one another. We maybe seeing the same thing here yet more expensive.

Re: J-xx

Roger604 said:

These pictures came from a magazine. It's not just a random photo on a website. It's highly unlikely that a magazine would PS something to pass it off. If you read closely, the magazine's name is "Modern Weapons" 现代兵器.

If this is a PS picture, where is a flaw? It's very difficult to just cut and paste a few different aircraft together and not have it look like a nightmare.

Thirdly, FC-1 is NOT in "early test flight stage"! It's done and has been done for a long time. Only the issue with exporting Russian engines remain. Timing wise, a successor to FC-1/JF-17 (a.k.a. JF-20) would be appropriate right about now.

I stand by my assessment, this photograph is real. Unless, of course, it is a photograph of some other existing, real aircraft not Chinese. But it doesn't appear to be.

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Unfortunetely, nowadays chinese military magazines have come a long way and became more and more like HongKong or Taiwan's fruit newspapers. I see them drop to Pinkov's standard in a not so distant future, evenif the government does not relax media control.

As long as you pay them, they can feed you with any sorts of positive news about China, just as Pinkov feeding negative English news about China because that's the type of news that he can get money in the western world.

Re: J-xx

MIGleader said:

it took ten years to make j-10 fly, and another 5 to make it operational.
i think j-xx will be operational around 2020

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dream on brother!!!

the J-XX will be operational latest by 2015

work is goin on in full steam:china:

Re: J-xx

nero said:

dream on brother!!!

the J-XX will be operational latest by 2015

work is goin on in full steam:china:

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What your view on the J-XX's spec roughly? That'll decide whether 2015 Operational status is achievable or not.

Re: J-xx

the pictures don't look that radical for an upgrade, though it makes you wonder what engine they used when considering how they don't even have a suitable single engine for export on JF-17.

JF-17 picture:

Re: J-xx

This article claims to be based on an interview with a designer of the original FC-1 / JF-17. Basically, the designer says that the FC-1 / JF-17 had to be built to be very low cost, and they had to cut a lot of corners to do that. So while developing FC-1 / JF-17, a modified version that would NOT be subject to the cost constraint was already considered. Then he goes on to talk in general terms about the modified successor to FC-1 / JF-17. (In my opinion, this is the JF-20 referred to by Pakistani officials.)

声明：MW设计局作品仅代表作者个人观点，本刊仅作为读者交流的平台将其刊登，供读者鉴赏。

设计师／王伟

“枭龙”改型

“枭龙”战机由我国和巴基斯坦联合研制，未来将做为巴方主力轻型战机以替代老旧的歼七。而做为我方，“枭龙”将成为一种面向第三世界国家，低廉的、可大量装备的外销机型。但“枭龙”由于是一种低端机型，很多地方采用了低成本、低性能的设计，可能很难满足部分国家对高性能战机的需求。因此，我尝试在不过多考虑成本的基础上对原“枭龙”做了部分修改。

首先，两型“枭龙”最大的外观区别在垂尾上。老“枭龙”采用的是高大的单垂尾，这样不仅会使整机高度过高，而且严重影响隐身性能。改型将单垂尾改为外倾的双垂尾，改善了隐身效果，并有效降低了机身高度。而且中国还没有自行设计制造过双垂尾的战斗机，相信这会是一次有益的尝试。 在机首处，改型将原来的圆截面机头改为菱形截面，这样可以增强飞机整体的隐身效果。而对于肋下进气的飞机，也可提高进气效率。改型继承了“枭龙”标志性的DSI进气口设计，只是因机头的变化而做了部分修形。

改型加大了圆边条的面积，一方面使飞机的低空低速性能更突出，另外也可加大机翼油箱的体积，使整机获得更大的航程。改型取消了原“枭龙”的背脊设计，并把座舱的高度提升，以获得更好的飞行视野。

另外，改型采用了更新的航电系统，提高了信息处理的能力，并且能够兼容更多的对地对空高精度武器，全面提升了整机的精确打击能力。改型换装了推力更大可靠性更高的发动机，使得飞机的挂载能力更强。并且加强了机体和起落架的结构，初步具备了上舰的可能。

If this article is legitimate, we can conclude several things.

1) China is making great strides in integrating stealth technology into aircraft. First the J-11B, and now this.

2) These photographs are deliberately revealed. Otherwise, they would have stayed under wraps. That magazine may have landed a major scoop by getting the chance to unveil it first.

3) The photograph of the aircraft taking off may or may not be real -- it may be CG, or it may be an actual prototype. But we can rule out the possibility that it is mere fan created art cobbled together from existing aircraft like F-35 and F-18.