Israeli-Palestinian Conflict and other Related Conflicts in the Middle East (read the rules in the first post)

IED flips bulldozer upside down

Top Israeli Humans Rights organization - B'Tselem - calls on Israel to stop ethnic cleansing

Hamas releases footage of attack that killed the IOF senior commander, a veteran of the 2006 Lebanon Invasion

IOF soldiers running with casualties after an ambush in southern Lebanon (crying may be edited/added)

Hezbollah missiles are now reaching Tel Aviv region; Palestinians on the other side of the wall celebrate; impact leaves a cloud of smoke across the city

iewgnem said:

Ukraine is a much more centralized military but Russia still knows killing Zelensky won't matter because real leaders are in NATO, Israel and the west does not function at this level of complexity.

Hamas and Hezbollah are and has always been a grass root decentralized guerrilla force, and even then their real leaders are in Iran. Israel isn't trying to win a war, Israel is trying to win propaganda, and not even global, because they've completely lost that one, but just propaganda within their small echo chamber of psychopaths.

The focus on propaganda over strategy seems to be a common problem with western thinking, it's why Ukraine advertised their 2023 offensive just to get anhiliated, it's why they refuse to retreat from cities despite guarenteed loss of massive force over rnothing, its why they YOLOed into Kursk.

Just like in Ukraine, Israel's focus on propaganda will lose them the war, and also just like Ukraine, it could very well be existential.

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The thing that boggles my mind is how after being in the region for 80 years Israel doesn’t understand the mindset of their enemies. They have been killing resistance leaders since the beginning of their existence and it has been proven time and time again it doesn’t work. Israel went on a campaign of assassinating Hamas’s leadership throughout the 2000s. It never worked. They were stupid enough to release the footage of Sinwar’s final moments showing him resisting to the end. Now they’ve turned him into an icon in the Islamic world. People are celebrating him from Morocco to Pakistan. And then they released the drone footage of 1 Hezbollah fighter pinning down a squad of IOF fighters. He was calm and unfazed by the incoming gunfire. And it has made that fighter icon amongst the Shia resistance. The axis of resistance understands Israel more than Israel understands them.

The biggest problem is that Israel’s hatred for Arabs/Persians has blinded them. It has made them arrogant and emotionally unhinged. They just assume they are animals that can either be put to heel by either being bribed or brutally crushed. That’s why they don’t care to understand their enemy. Also the religious aspect of them believing they are the “chosen ones,” that means God will intercede to give them victory over their enemies. It’s almost a the same type of insanity we saw with ISIS. Israel isn’t rational. This is why Israel keeps finding itself in this never ending cycle of war. They cannot sustain this. Just like ISIS which found itself fighting so many factions they’ll burn out. Only difference is they have nukes. There is no doubt in my mind that if they find themselves with their back against the wall and/or the US suffers a terrible defeat in the region they’ll break the nuclear taboo. America’s refusal to bring yank the leash of their Israeli dog is going to have harsh ramifications. That’s why I’m alarmed at all of this because we are currently in the worst case possible scenario.

Index said:

Yes, in the grand scheme of things, Israel is just loud about genocidal intent, but not effective at carrying it out. The fiasco with ending Gaza despite a whole year against a force that doesn't even have MANPADS is proof enough. It will take many years to even start making a dent in the reserve pools of Israels enemies... A far cry from the chilling effectiveness of Rwanda genocidaires or other groups with similar intent as Israel.

You are mostly correct that it is a propaganda effect which puts Israel under unprecedented scrutiny, criticism and economical consequence. The ability to rally so many people against Israel, despite their low effectiveness compared to similar regimes, is a testament to the shortage of propaganda soft power among Israel's allies, and the increasing or nowadays even dominant power to control discourse by US' enemies.

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On this, I agree completely with all your points. In fact, the average person is very easy to change their perception. The media is quite good in shaping peoples perception. If the Israel/Palestine war was not publicised in the media as it is done constantly then people wouldn't feel so strongly about this conflict the way it has been this past year. So yes the media basically decides and affects people perception and actions. We haven't seen the same level of concern with other more brutal and deadly wars/regimes/killings. This proves that its not just about human lives but other reasons at play.

_killuminati_ said:

No recent war has been this brutal and gross where every section of one society is calling for genocide and mass murder of another. Israel, as a whole, the state and the people, openly support genocide and celebrate the mass murder. That is something missing in previous wars, something a normal belligerent would avoid or attempt to hide. Where else have you seen in a recent war that an aggressor tells people to move to a "safe-spot" to avoid harm and then bombs that safe-spot? The Israeli Apartheid war is special because it has broken every single rule of human rights law, violated every international convention that protects civilians, deliberately targeted international aid workers, UN staff, medics, doctors, hospitals, children, and totally proud of the act. Israel has shown to the world that it does not care about anything the global community has developed over the centuries wrt to the conservation of human life, and is above the law (of Goyim). That is why the world is appalled by this war. And that is probably also why the Jews have never had a stable state of their own (because they simply do not know how to function as sovereigns).

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Lool If you really believe that this is the most brutal/gross war in our modern history then I can only say you are wrong on this. Just because you feel more passionate and emotional about the Israel/Palestine issue doesn't means its a universal things. You need to broaden more your views and also focus/learn more about other conflicts that have taken place recently and those still ongoing around the world.
It's silly to think this is the worse war mankind has seen in recent memory. Lol Far from it dude.

Botnet said:

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“BREAKING: Hezbollah confirms that top official Hashem Safieddine, expected to be the group's next leader, was killed in an Israeli airstrike.”

Who do they even have left? Seems like Hezbollah’s upper echelons have been essentially erased.

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I don't even know why they appoint new leaders anymore. Just let the group function on its own or hide the leaders and send them in Iran or something to keep them safe. Nowhere in Lebanon is safe for an important Hezbollah leader so better to keep them away in another friendly country like Iran or Qatar.

iewgnem said:

Just like in Ukraine, Israel's focus on propaganda will lose them the war, and also just like Ukraine, it could very well be existential.

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Yeah. It's depends on what you mean by loss. I don't think Israels objective is to occupy Lebanon. Their objective is to degrade Hezbollahs capabilities to the point it doesn't represent a threat to them and their cities anymore. I'm.sorry but Israel isn't going anywhere. The others will have to get used to living with them in the neighbourhood. At the end of the day, all parties will need to seat down at the table and negotiate so they can come to some sort of agreement and yes some concessions will have to be made by both sides.

I actually think Lebanon has lost far more than anyone I'm this Israel/Gaza conflict. Afterall the country was already bankrupt and relying on western international financial agencies(IMF/World bank) and Gulf Arab states goodwill/aid to survive their financial and economic crisis. This conflict and the destruction Israel is inflicting Lebanon will take decades to recover from, especially after the country was finally recovering from the destruction caused by the 2006 war with Israel. At this rate I'm not sure how many more such wars can the country sustain before total economic collapse.
Plus we have to also keep in mind that there is also a significant percent of Lebanese population who doesnt support Hezbollah and their policies in the region. This can also lead to instability and crisis if Israel weakens Hezbollah to a significant extent. Their adversaries might make use of this. So I hope the war ends soon and all sides can come to negotiating table.

Michael90 said:

Yeah. It's depends on what you mean by loss. I don't think Israels objective is to occupy Lebanon. Their objective is to degrade Hezbollahs capabilities to the point it doesn't represent a threat to them and their cities anymore. I'm.sorry but Israel isn't going anywhere. The others will have to get used to living with them in the neighbourhood. At the end of the day, all parties will need to seat down at the table and negotiate so they can come to some sort of agreement and yes some concessions will have to be made by both sides.

I actually think Lebanon has lost far more than anyone I'm this Israel/Gaza conflict. Afterall the country was already bankrupt and relying on western international financial agencies(IMF/World bank) and Gulf Arab states goodwill/aid to survive their financial and economic crisis. This conflict and the destruction Israel is inflicting Lebanon will take decades to recover from, especially after the country was finally recovering from the destruction caused by the 2006 war with Israel. At this rate I'm not sure how many more such wars can the country sustain before total economic collapse.
Plus we have to also keep in mind that there is also a significant percent of Lebanese population who doesnt support Hezbollah and their policies in the region. This can also lead to instability and crisis if Israel weakens Hezbollah to a significant extent. Their adversaries might make use of this. So I hope the war ends soon and all sides can come to negotiating table.

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A big consequence of this conflict and the Syrian civil war is the change in demographics in Lebanon. Christians refugees can move to Europe more easily. Shia people are moving from the south towards the central, traditionally Christian areas. They still have thousands of Muslim Syrian refugees. Rather than turning Lebanon against Hezbollah, the Israeli terrorist campaign might make Lebanon are more united country under islam with reduced Christian presence

And a less Christian and economically devastated Lebanon, will be more dependent on Syria and Iran. That doesn't sound like an improvement of the strategic situation for Jewish state to me

Michael90 said:

Yeah. It's depends on what you mean by loss. I don't think Israels objective is to occupy Lebanon. Their objective is to degrade Hezbollahs capabilities to the point it doesn't represent a threat to them and their cities anymore. I'm.sorry but Israel isn't going anywhere. The others will have to get used to living with them in the neighbourhood. At the end of the day, all parties will need to seat down at the table and negotiate so they can come to some sort of agreement and yes some concessions will have to be made by both sides.

I actually think Lebanon has lost far more than anyone I'm this Israel/Gaza conflict. Afterall the country was already bankrupt and relying on western international financial agencies(IMF/World bank) and Gulf Arab states goodwill/aid to survive their financial and economic crisis. This conflict and the destruction Israel is inflicting Lebanon will take decades to recover from, especially after the country was finally recovering from the destruction caused by the 2006 war with Israel. At this rate I'm not sure how many more such wars can the country sustain before total economic collapse.
Plus we have to also keep in mind that there is also a significant percent of Lebanese population who doesnt support Hezbollah and their policies in the region. This can also lead to instability and crisis if Israel weakens Hezbollah to a significant extent. Their adversaries might make use of this. So I hope the war ends soon and all sides can come to negotiating table.

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Wow, trading 1 for 1 with Lebanon is a great deal. You sure you want them to take it? Try telling them that, see what they'll do to you.

Even if Lebanon's economy collapses, so what? The guys with guns - Hezbollah - starve last. Consequences for Iran is 0. If Israel doesn't occupy or eliminate the entire country, within a few months they'll have rockets launched from there again with the difference that Lebanon now has nothing to lose.

They'll also make all the talented Lebanese flee to the West, as a hostile overseas lobby making western wages sending remittances, while leaving the hardened fighters in, as a hostile stay at home force. Brilliant plan to actively help move the enemy's logistical and financial center of gravity far out of reach while still having to face their field forces.

Hezbollah should appoint an AI generated leader to confuse Israel, wait for Israel to announce the death of said leader, then blow the whistle on the AI part in order to embarrass them.

News channels tour Al-Sahel hospital in Beirut. They are all have access to the entire hospital unsupervised.

RT says they didn't find anything belonging to Hezbollah in the basements.

Sky News claims they aren't allowed unrestricted access and that the gold may be somewhere in the hospital behind a door they didn't open.

Lloyd Austin says there is no evidence of Hezbollah owned assets in the hospital.

I don't understand why Lebanon doesn't invite UN inspectors and stand their ground instead of evacuating.

Michael90 said:

Lool If you really believe that this is the most brutal/gross war in our modern history then I can only say you are wrong on this. Just because you feel more passionate and emotional about the Israel/Palestine issue doesn't means its a universal things. You need to broaden more your views and also focus/learn more about other conflicts that have taken place recently and those still ongoing around the world.
It's silly to think this is the worse war mankind has seen in recent memory. Lol Far from it dude.

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This is because your timeline starts at Oct 7 and you are just here to facetiously provoke and insult people that have an all encompassing view that starts at 1948.

Michael90 said:

Lool If you really believe that this is the most brutal/gross war in our modern history then I can only say you are wrong on this. Just because you feel more passionate and emotional about the Israel/Palestine issue doesn't means its a universal things. You need to broaden more your views and also focus/learn more about other conflicts that have taken place recently and those still ongoing around the world.
It's silly to think this is the worse war mankind has seen in recent memory. Lol Far from it dude.

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My comment: you're wrong because of reasons 1, 2, 3, 4..

Your comment: you're wrong, just trust me

Michael90 said:

Yeah. It's depends on what you mean by loss. I don't think Israels objective is to occupy Lebanon. Their objective is to degrade Hezbollahs capabilities to the point it doesn't represent a threat to them and their cities anymore. I'm.sorry but Israel isn't going anywhere. The others will have to get used to living with them in the neighbourhood.

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Have you seen Israeli media these days? All the talk is about Lebanon being part of the Promised Land.

Given their history, it's more likely they'll go away than stay put anywhere. Europeans kicked them around like a football for millenia until a German midfielder's free kick landed them out of the continent via the Haavara Agreement between the Nazis and the Zionist Federation of Germany.

They don't have history of permanently settling anywhere. They are like the foam of the sea - tossed around by the current but have no control of the current itself.