ISIS/ISIL conflict in Syria/Iraq (No OpEd, No Politics)

plawolf

Lieutenant General
It doesn't look like an accident. It looked like they pushed it for a long time all over the world and thought it will be as always - who cares about X, we're Russians!

Whoever said it was an accident? Nice strawman.

The official Turkish explanation doesn't match their own pretty graphic.

The part of Turkish territory the Su24 was alleged to have violated is 3km wide, a Su24 at cruise speed of 600km/h would have crossed it in 18 seconds. How do you warn it 10 times in 5 minutes within 18 seconds (36 if it did do two passes)? :rolleyes:

Even if we are generous and assume a 20 second flyover time, that Su24 would have had to have done 15 loops to have violated Turkish airspace long enough to match the official Turkish version of events.

Blame Syrians fpr not reacting. Not Turks.

Yeah, its the victim's fault for being too weak to be able to resist, not the fault of the aggressor. :rolleyes:

If Syrians had shot down Turkish plane on combat mission in their airspace you wouldn't argue too much. Am I right?

If the downed Turkish jet was bombing Syrian territory when it was engaged? How could anyone reasonably blame Syria for that? :rolleyes:
 

aksha

Captain
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Citing a Kuwaiti daily, the Jerusalem Post
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that Russia has begun ground operations in Syria — and is helping to hold recent territorial gains made by Syria's army against the “moderate” rebels (yes, that includes ISIS). The report claims that

Russian military forces have been providing cover for T-90 tanks along with military air support which have attacked multiple strategic targets held by rebel forces in Idlib and Latakia.

In September,
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claimed that Russia had positioned about a half dozen tanks at a Syrian airfield at the center of a military buildup.
One US official said seven Russian T-90 tanks were observed at the airfield near Latakia, a stronghold of Syrian President Bashar Assad.

The Kuwaiti report adds that Russian forces have already taken over multiple strategic positions and have forced numerous rebel battalions to retreat. The report did not disclose whether there were Russian army casualties.



Iran's state-controlled Fars news agency
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— an interesting move, considering Iran's close military cooperation with Russia in Syria.

The reality is that there is almost certainly some level of Russian involvement on the ground against ISIS and its “moderate” partners in crime. It could be a handful of Russian military advisors, or limited special operations carried out by Russia's elite forces. Or, as this report claims, it's possible that Russian forces have begun to help Syria consolidate gains made possible by
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.

According to Assad, Syrian forces
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on “almost” all fronts — and they probably need help holding these positions.

The truth, whether we want to admit it openly or not, is that no war can be won from the air. You need boots on the ground. But are they Russian boots? According to this new report, some of them are.
 

Janiz

Senior Member
Whoever said it was an accident? Nice strawman.
Its very easy for a fighter jet to accidentally stray over the boarder in a situation like that
Ok.
The part of Turkish territory the Su24 was alleged to have violated is 3km wide, a Su24 at cruise speed of 600km/h would have crossed it in 18 seconds. How do you warn it 10 times in 5 minutes within 18 seconds (36 if it did do two passes)? :rolleyes:

Even if we are generous and assume a 20 second flyover time, that Su24 would have had to have done 15 loops to have violated Turkish airspace long enough to match the official Turkish version of events.
Have you looked at the radar picture with TWO Russian fighters tracking data released by Turks? There was enough time to warn them not to violate the airspace. If they'll release audio someday it will be all clear. And now you know how fast those systems work and how much airspace they need. Not to mention that such a place on the Turkish border (going few km into Syria territory) must have been always pretty much arme

RDOcXwY.jpg

Yeah, its the victim's fault for being too weak to be able to resist, not the fault of the aggressor. :rolleyes:
I don't remember you were so kind for Ukraine earlier...
 
already Oct 3, 2015
...
I found yet another map of Russian attacks:
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...
... and in the on-line coverage of today's events by gazeta.ru
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already at 11.47 reporters mentioned two days old Turkish protests about Russian air-strikes in northwestern Syria, which I checked, found in Russian source:
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Now a close-up of the map above (from the beginning of October, I repeat):
g28zs.jpg
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Ok.Have you looked at the radar picture with TWO Russian fighters tracking data released by Turks? There was enough time to warn them not to violate the airspace.

If you cannot understand a simple graph, not much I want do about it. I would suggest you go back and look at that graphic real hard and then re-read what I wrote and figure it out.

If they'll release audio someday it will be all clear. And now you know how fast those systems work and how much airspace they need. Not to mention that such a place on the Turkish border (going few km into Syria territory) must have been always pretty much arme

Just what on earth are you going on about here?
I don't remember you were so kind for Ukraine earlier...

Funny, I don't remember any scenario in Ukraine that is remotely comparable, never mind what I was kind or unkind about.
 
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