Either way it tells us this is not the way to do things and I'm very afraid of the consequences and of our current leadership to adequately handle them especially if and when one of ours goes down
ISIS/ISIL conflict in Syria/Iraq (No OpEd, No Politics)
- Thread starter Jeff Head
- Start date
Zool
Junior Member
Not so much, no. BBC News actually has Putin quoted as to exactly why that area was targeted and it had everything to do with eliminating Russian extremist fighters so that they don't return home and continue the violence. Makes sense to me particularly after Paris... Here it is:
LIVE Russia warplane shot down in Syria
- 32 minutes ago
- From the section
Turkish warplanes have shot down a Russian military aircraft on the border with Syria.
Russian President Vladimir Putin said the Su-24 was hit by air-to-air missiles fired by Turkish F-16s while it was flying over Syrian territory.
But Turkish military officials said the plane was engaged after being warned that it was violating Turkish airspace.
Mr Putin described the incident as a "stab in the back" committed by "accomplices of terrorists".
The crew ejected before the jet crashed in Latakia province, but Syrian rebels said at least one was dead.
It is the first time a Russian aircraft has crashed in Syria since Moscow launched air strikes against opponents of President Bashar al-Assad in late September.
The Nato military alliance, to which Turkey belongs, said it was following the situation "closely" and was in contact with the Turkish authorities. There will be an "informational meeting" of ambassadors in Brussels at 16:00 GMT.
'Exclusively above Syria'
At a meeting with King Abdullah II of Jordan in Sochi, Russia's president confirmed that the Su-24 had been shot down over Syrian territory, 1km (0.6 miles) from the Turkish border, by an air-to-air missile from a Turkish F-16 jet.
It crashed in Syrian territory 4km (2.5 miles) from the border, he added.
Turkey's military said the Russian warplane was warned that it was violating Turkish airspace
Russia's defence ministry said it could prove the aircraft never left Syrian airspace
"This goes beyond the normal struggle against terrorism. This was a stab in the back by the accomplices of terrorists," Mr Putin stated.
"Our pilots and our plane did not in any way threaten Turkey. It is quite clear," he added.
"They were carrying out an operation against [Islamic State militants] in the mountains of northern Latakia, where militants who originate from Russian territory are concentrated. So they were carrying the key task of preventative attacks against those who could return to Russia at any time."
A feared incident - Jonathan Marcus, BBC defence correspondent
This is exactly the kind of incident that many have feared since Russia launched its air operations in Syria. The dangers of operating near to the Turkish border have been all too apparent. Turkish planes have already shot down at least one Syrian air force jet and possibly a helicopter as well.
Russia insists that its warplane did not violate Turkish air space. So, was the Russian pilot's navigation wrong? Questions will also be asked about the readiness of the Turks to open fire.
It suggests that the much discussed arrangements to avoid incidents between warplanes over Syria are inadequate. The Turkish authorities will no doubt claim that such arrangements do not cover the approaches to their own airspace where tried and tested procedures should apply.
There are conflicting reports as to whether it was ground fire or Turkish jets that brought down the Russian plane. Air operations in the crowded skies over Syria just got a good deal more complicated. The only mitigating factor is that initial reports suggest that two parachutes were seen so the Russian crew at least got out of their stricken aircraft. Expect diplomatic fireworks.
However, the Turkish military said two F-16s on patrol had fired on an unidentified aircraft at 09:24 (07:24 GMT) after warning it 10 times over five minutes about violating Turkish airspace over the town of Yayladagi, in Hatay province.
It noted that the F-16s had intervened "in accordance with the rules of engagement", which were changed after Syria shot down a Turkish plane in 2012.
The UK-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said the jet had crashed in the mountainous Jabal Turkmen area of Latakia, where air strikes and fighting between rebels and Syrian government forces had been reported earlier on Tuesday.
Russian military helicopters searched for the pilot and navigator near the crash site in the predominantly Turkmen Bayir Bucak area, Turkey's Dogan news agency reported.
A spokesman for a rebel group operating in the area, the 10th Brigade of the Coast, told the Associated Press that the jet's crew had tried to parachute into government-held territory, but that they came under fire from members of the group.
One of them was dead when he landed on the ground, he added. The fate of the second was not immediately known.
Russian Su-24 aircraft based in Latakia province have flown hundreds of sorties over Syria
Turkey had warned Russia not to support a Syrian government offensive on Turkmen villages
A video was posted online showing gunmen standing around a man in a flight suit who was immobile on the ground, either badly wounded or dead.
Russian aircraft have flown hundreds of sorties over northern Syria since September. Moscow says they have targeted only "terrorists", but activists say its strikes have mainly hit Western-backed rebel groups.
Turkey, a vehement opponent of Syria's president, has warned against violations of its airspace by Russian and Syrian aircraft.
Last month, Ankara said Turkish F-16s had intercepted a Russian jet that crossed its border and two Turkish jets had been harassed by an unidentified Mig-29.
The Turkish foreign ministry also summoned the Russian ambassador last week to warn him that there would be "serious consequences" if the Russian air force did not immediately stop bombing "civilian Turkmen villages" in Bayir Bucak.
In a separate development on Tuesday, three Russian journalists were lightly wounded on Monday while driving in a convoy towards the Syrian government army frontline near Dagmashliya, in north-western Syria. Their vehicles came under fire, apparently from TOW anti-tank missiles.
Russian media named them as Tass correspondent Alexander Yelistratov, Russia Today Arabic Service TV correspondent Sargon Khadaya and RT English correspondent Roman Kosarev.
That's the reason why they're bombarding other places in Syria also. Not a reason to trespass the Turkish border without notice or when it's forbidden. It's hard to say bad things about Turkey in such situation. No matter if they fought against ISIS or sponsored them. It's their right as a sovereign nation. If Putin had said that he sent some of his 'bombardirovschiks' over Paris because there are 'Russian extremist fighters' that would be OK as well?
That is for the Politicians to figure out I am very concerned this will lead to a serious escalation if their not very and I do mean very careful and from what little I understand stand that is exactly what Isis wants in other words a war between east and west with them in the middle Lord help us if that happens
plawolf
Lieutenant General
You are acting like the Russians were bombing Turkish soil. They were not.
Its very easy for a fighter jet to accidentally stray over the boarder in a situation like that (and I am going to pre-empty the "well the Russians shouldn't have been flying so close to the boarder then" crowd with the counter that the Russians would not have had to fly that close to the boarder if the Turks had lifted a finger to stop its territory from being used by terrorists).
In fact, the Turks are hardly in any position to be using that line of reasoning, since unlike the Russians, Turkish warplanes have not only also violated Syrian airspace, but had in fact also bombed Syrian soil.
The Turks pulled this exact some stunt against the Syrian air force, shooting down a fighter and helicopter inside Syrian airspace (where the pilots were also murdered by terrorist forces on the ground). But they are in for a very rude awakening if they think they can bully the Russians like they did the Syrians.
The Russians will not take this lying down.
ShahryarHedayat
Junior Member
"RuAF helicopter crashed north of Kafriyeh after being hit by a rocket from militants in Al-Nuba area. The crew were safely evacuated, RuAF then bombarded the grounded helicopter and destroyed it."
janjak desalin
Junior Member
Turkey just made it more difficult for French, US, and NATO aircraft over Syria. Russia can now, justifiably, claim that NATO members intentions are to support terrorism at the risk of nuclear war, and their aircraft now will not be allowed to violate Syrian Airspace. Here come the S-400's and the Su-35's.
And, btw, bye bye Turkey! Thanks for the lovely architecture.
No European nation is going down for you!
Do you really think that Greece will come to your aid?
Expect Turkey's genocide of the Armenian people to become a major international issue, soon!
And, btw, bye bye Turkey! Thanks for the lovely architecture.
No European nation is going down for you!
Do you really think that Greece will come to your aid?
Expect Turkey's genocide of the Armenian people to become a major international issue, soon!
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plawolf
Lieutenant General
I think the French at least would be furious at this Turkish move.
Just as they and the Russians are in the final stages of setting up a massive multinational coalition to totally destroy ISIS with UN backing, the Turks did this out of the blue.
A cynical person might think the Turks did this precisely to scupper the Franco-Russo led coalition before it could be formed...
Just as they and the Russians are in the final stages of setting up a massive multinational coalition to totally destroy ISIS with UN backing, the Turks did this out of the blue.
A cynical person might think the Turks did this precisely to scupper the Franco-Russo led coalition before it could be formed...
plawolf
Lieutenant General
Lets not post pictures of the dead. Let them have their dignity at least.