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FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
Rome did, but India is more akin to forcibly unified Europe, not Rome. And while Rome is long gone, Indiavas a cultural entity is still more or less with us, despite being about as old.

If taking seriously means drastic solutions, they can't. Only extremely authoritarian (in this context it means capable) leaders can sway such countries... provided anyone can at all, as unifying India into something unitary has never happened - it's that hard.
And such leaders don't get born during Peace.

There's no way to Qin India; careful treading, manoeuvering and placating interests is the only safe way.
let me point out a specific instance of not taking it seriously when they could've taken it seriously.

India pulled out of FGFA Su-57 project with Russia, with the excuse that Su-57 was both immature and obsolete. First, I have to ask, what right does India have to mock Russia of all countries as having an immature and obsolete program when they can barely make a Mig-21 equivalent? Second, look at what China did.

China humbly bought the Su-27 from Russia in 1992 even though it was only on parity with the F-16s that Taiwan received the same year. And Russia was in very bad shape that year, with no guarantee that the Su-27 would get any support whatsoever.

In the next 25 years, China studied everything about the Su-27, despite being laughed at as being a copycat. First it was indigenized as the J-11. Then, structural components and avionics were upgraded in the J-11B. Then, a far upgraded version was made as the J-16. Now it is the best Flanker in the world.

India could've done that, but for bragging rights, refused. They believed they were entitled to a better plane they can just walk into, demand all the IP for, and walk away with. No, it doesn't work that way, nobody will teach you everything step by step for free, and nobody will reveal their best secrets even if paid.. They could've humbled themselves, begged the Russians for help, paid any price. But they refused. They wanted a deal, they wanted to be treated like kings, and today, no matter what, at least the Su-57 is flying with Russian colors. Where's AMCA?
 

valysre

Junior Member
Registered Member
India could've done that, but for bragging rights, refused.
I've always felt that India is a bit of a 杨康 to China's 郭靖 (although somewhat superficially). 杨康 sees 郭靖's successes as a direct result of his notable teachers and tries to imitate this by going to other martial artists of similar stature to learn but fails to recognize that 郭靖's work ethic and general willingness to recognize others as better and learn from them is an even greater contributor to his success.

杨康 ironically ends up dying to a poison of his own making, just as India today flounders because of stupid decisions in the past. India thought itself too good to learn earnestly, just as 杨康, and now we see India (continue to) fail.
 

coolgod

Colonel
Registered Member
Laser eyes Jaishankar visited the US to meet Mike Waltz, presumably to beg for F-35s.

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Jaishankar meets Trump's NSA-pick Waltz; discusses bilateral ties, global issues​

Waltz, who will replace Jake Sullivan on January 20, has sponsored several India-friendly legislations in the House of Representatives​


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valysre

Junior Member
Registered Member
Laser eyes Jaishankar visited the US to meet Mike Waltz, presumably to beg for F-35s.

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Jaishankar meets Trump's NSA-pick Waltz; discusses bilateral ties, global issues​

Waltz, who will replace Jake Sullivan on January 20, has sponsored several India-friendly legislations in the House of Representatives​


View attachment 142050
With the recent rash of anti-Indian opinions from prominent politicians on the US right, I imagine this bill will die in committee. I don't think it'll progress too far. Won't stop our dear friend Jaishankar from begging a little harder, though!
 

coolgod

Colonel
Registered Member
With the recent rash of anti-Indian opinions from prominent politicians on the US right, I imagine this bill will die in committee. I don't think it'll progress too far. Won't stop our dear friend Jaishankar from begging a little harder, though!
Hard to say, I've previously posted a few articles on how the Indian lobby is growing in the US. The US might dangle F-35s to keep India in check, maybe finally deliver them post 2030. India air force seems forced to make a decision soon.

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As Yet Another Committee Takes Off, There's No End in Sight to the Indian Air Force's Woes​

Chandigarh: In yet another replay of a hackneyed script, the Union government has constituted a committee under defence secretary Rajesh Kumar Singh to suggest means to augment the Indian Air Force (IAF)’s waning operational capabilities, via a combination of platform imports and indigenously sourced assets.

Quoting unnamed sources, the Times of India
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on Monday that this committee, comprising IAF deputy chief of staff Air Marshal Tejinder Singh, Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) head Samir Kamat and secretary of defence production Sanjeev Kumar, has been tasked with submitting its recommendations by end-January 2025.
Its remit: to once more determine guidelines to swiftly bolster the IAF’s declining combat fleet, down to around 30 of 42 sanctioned fighter squadrons, to potentially counter the collusive threat from nuclear and military allies Pakistan and China, alongside boosting force multipliers like re-fuellers and airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) platforms, amongst others resources.

“It is hard to comprehend the need for constituting such a committee, given that the problems and shortcomings are well-known, as are the solutions and procedures,” said Amit Cowshish, former Ministry of Defence (MoD) acquisitions advisor.
 

valysre

Junior Member
Registered Member
said Amit Cowshish
No bets on what I first read this as.
maybe finally deliver them post 2030.
Unironically probably before Tejas is mass produced.
I've previously posted a few articles on how the Indian lobby is growing in the US.
I think that while the Indian lobby won't shrink, it won't be growing as quickly as it was. Again, lots of anti-Indian rhetoric coming in in the past week. Of course, this may just be a small tripping block in the development of a long and prosperous Indian-US relationship.
 
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