Hong Kong....Occupy Central Demonstrations....

airsuperiority said:

Thank you so much. Your words mean a lot to us right now. This really means a lot. You have no idea what my facebook and the emotions of my friends are like right now. Everyone's feeling like sh!t. Everything I have shown you is literally what I have seen on my Facebook right now. It's almost no longer possible for us to deny that HK is now corrupted and with what is happening there. The reason I was so supportive of them is because I see them like my younger brothers and sisters, and they carried hope, beliefs, in fighting for their future, what they think is right and their dignities, although without knowing the unsustainable lifestyles ahead of them. And tonight, they are being attacked and touched and insulted and humiliated. It's true, no one thinks of them as students anymore. They are now exposed to the cruelties of this world, with their innocence being ripped out of their hearts. Whereas the days before they were the most peaceful protestors in the world, now they are being victimized and experiencing the anarchist inflicted upon them by government-warranted thugs and the corrupted police.
I would have flown back to support them few days ago, but if I am to fly back now, I wanted to protect them. Like a taxi driver said, "Let us take the beating. You have a future ahead." I can't bear my eyes to watch them watch their hopes being skinned by the cruelties of this society. They now experienced the darkness of power, politics, greed, ignorance. I hope they haven't lost their hopes yet. Maybe they can teach me a thing or 2 back, about courage, because my hopes now only extend to protect them and had given up all hopes on this city. I worried they may be the last generation who still believes in change in HK. This city is near dead otherwise. The life there is unsustainable, and yet they are the ones who will have to suffer it all. They are trying to make a stand, but the adults are crushing them. For everything we teach our children about hope, love, good karma, power in their hands and to make a living, we are shoving it in their face and letting them see it's all a big lie, a lie used to keep the population foolish, not because anyone genuinely believes in good anymore. People who said they have to work and feed a family are now sneering and jeering and supporting the attacks on these kids. If your kids are precious, are these kids nothing just because they belong to someone else?


But, your words are kind and it's been received. Thank you so much.

Click to expand...

Brumby said:

On paper but the argument from the other camp is that the 35 sub sectors are essentially commerce based and tend to be attentive to Beijing's preference. I believe there is a push to broaden the sectors from which to elect the committee members so that it is more in line with the principle of broad representation as promised in the Basic Law.

I think the movement is pushing for a broader base truly representing HK and change to the 50 % requirement which is already approved by NPC but not ratified by Legco. If Legco. fails to pass the change then by default it reverts to status quo which is CE election by the 1200 member committee and hence no universal suffrage. I think the general view of the pro democracy camp is that no universal suffrage is better than a sham.

Click to expand...

f commerce is the lifeblood of this fast-dealing metropolis, Ben Pui was having little of it Saturday idling behind his glass shop counter filled with exotic medicinal herbs.

“Business is down 90%,” said Pui, whose pharmacy is directly across from one of the most heated protest sites, a densely packed neighborhood known as Mong Kok. “It’s just crazy. A lot of stores could close. The protesters aren’t being rational. They should go stay at the government offices.”

As demonstrations for democratic reforms reached their seventh day, Hong Kong’s business community is finding it increasingly hard to stomach the widespread disruptions.

The Hang Seng Index saw its steepest decline since March last week. Banks closed branches near demonstration sites. And luxury retailers were starved for mainland Chinese tourists, who have been prevented by nervous leaders in Beijing from visiting Hong Kong during one of the territory’s prime holiday seasons.

A Hong Kong-based economist at ANZ Banking Co., an Australian and New Zealand lender, estimated sales at luxury stores were down 70% since the holiday started Oct. 1 – amounting to a loss of $285 million.

The Hong Kong Federation of Restaurants and Related Trades estimated business would drop 30% over the holiday, according to news reports.

High-end hotels near the primary protest sites on Hong Kong Island are also experiencing disruptions. The Upper House, an ultra-trendy boutique hotel in the business district Admiralty, canceled its anniversary party Wednesday, deciding it was “prudent to have as few people in the area as possible,” according to an email sent to guests.

On Friday, Hong Kong’s financial secretary, John Tsang, called for the demonstrations to end, saying any prolonged unrest could result in “permanent damage” to the city’s economy.

That was of little consequence to many protesters in Mong Kok on Saturday, many of whom were still smarting from clashes a day earlier with opponents, an often menacing band of middle-aged men who were shown to have ties to criminal gangs known as triads, according to police.

“I understand the inconvenience this is causing the shops, but we’re trying to get a direct response from the government. Until they do that, we’ll stay here,” said Mattson Yeung, a 21-year-old communications major at Hong Kong Baptist University, who wore a construction helmet and stationed himself in a blocked intersection ordinarily bustling with traffic.

On three corners of the intersection were branches for Citibank, HSBC and Shanghai Commercial Bank. All were shuttered behind metal gates.

Peaceful protest Ok but there is red line " law" that apply not just by the western countries ! If My businesses got disrupted WHO is going to pay the cost? let'S say those protesters got the wish I live in LA and also have investment there. our LA city Police would allow THAT...

Hong Kong’s embattled Chief Executive Leung Chun-ying called for talks between students and members of his administration Thursday. But the meeting was ditched after students accused the government of failing to protect them from violent opponents Friday in Mong Kok.

The protesters, consisting largely of high school and college students, have been calling for Leung’s resignation. The unrest was sparked by the announcement that Beijing would vet all candidates for chief executive instead of giving residents greater say.

But the spillover of anger is also driven by longstanding grievances, not the least of which is the belief that Beijing is stifling Hong Kong’s separate identity and flooding the city with speculative money that has skyrocketed housing prices and made it harder for ordinary residents to get by.

Resentment toward mainlanders has continued to grow. In Mong Kok on Saturday, democracy demonstrators demanded that their hecklers produce Hong Kong identification cards, suspecting many came from across the border.

Shouting matches between the two sides, punctuated by profanity, erupted throughout the day next to barricades erected by the protesters.

“You don’t have to work? You have money to blow,” an enraged middle-aged woman shouted to demonstrators.

Fresh-faced students, many carrying neon-colored backpacks and wearing high-top sneakers, coached one another not to argue and to avoid confrontation.

“Just ignore them,” one student said under a tarp where supplies such as bottled water and bread vied for space with exhausted protesters. One sat amid the chaos and read her textbook – “Introduction to Financial Accounting.”

Unlike Friday, there was a noticeable police presence at the scene to defuse tension at the barricades.

Still, many protesters felt they were at the mercy of mobs intent on driving the occupiers out.

“I’m really scared,” said Ruben Chan, 30, an IT worker. “I don’t believe the police are doing enough.”

Click to expand...

Franklin said:

I wonder if the HK CE CY Leung isn't secretly hoping that these protests would last some what longer. As I understand he was widely unpopular with the majority of the Hongkongese even amongst those outside of the OC movement. Now because of the behaviour of the OC crowd people are starting to rally around him and the HK goverment just to oppose the OC guys. There is now even a pro-government blue ribbon movement in Hong Kong. Lets hope HK doesn't turn into another Thailand.

I think it would be wise for the OC to make a tactical redraw at this point and to make a comeback later. (Which at this point is not happening) Because emotions are so high right now in HK that people may just take the opposite position and view of the OC movement just for the sake of it. And the OC movement may actually succeed in what Beijing and CY Leung couldn't do. Make the majority of the Hongkongese support the new elections arrangements.

Click to expand...

xiabonan said:

Well at least it shows that there are HK citizens who are not thugs and really find it disturbing, right?

To be frank I can't understand fully what's there because I don't speak Cantonese, but as far as I can understand, I see opinions from both sides.

It's probably not the case that "anyone who opposes OC are government hired thugs aimed at beating up students and molesting young girls". This is all I'm trying to say. I want to do some research and see for myself what are the voices of Hong Kong people, whether pro-OC or anti-OC. And I try to bring them here on this forum so that everyone who's not able to read Chinese can have some resources as well.

I care about HK, I care about the students and their wants, but I think I can never neglect the lives and voices of other ordinary residents.

Click to expand...

jobjed said:

It's understandable that your emotions have gotten inflamed, as you have pointed out in previous posts, but it doesn't validate nor justify your accusations above. Your accusations against SampanViking are a logical fallacy, namely 'argument to accomplishment'.

Your being there does not preclude others outside of Hong Kong of also knowing the situation. That assertion might have been valid in ancient times without recording devices or rapid communications but it's the 21st century and everyone around the world can immediately see and hear what's happening. Yes, his tone was condescending but his manner does not invalidate his argument, it simply makes him unlikable.

I really suggest for you to take a rest or maybe ask the mods to close this thread for a while so that you could replenish yourself; our emotions overwhelm our rationality when we're tired. Furthermore, you know it's a bad sign when a troll decides to like your comment. You've already made known your disdain for extremists who wave Union Jacks around HK; this particular individual is just as bad, if not worse.

Click to expand...

airsuperiority said:

Thank you for showing the other side. In fact, I am already very appreciative of your efforts and being fair with your words. I totally don't deny there are anti-OC at all, not to mention I didn't really think too highly of OC at some point and almost can say I'm anti-OC before 9.28 happened. Keep it up

Show both sides of the story because you will uncover a lot more than you think you see, believe me. Even amongst the anti-OC there are the good and the bad, and for the pro-OC(I'm more pro-students), we don't have problems with anti-OC in general, just the attackers, those who stand by to let it happen, and the police that are the issues.(and of course CY being the head of evil)

Click to expand...

airsuperiority said:

I took a look and noticed the opinions are swaying both sides, although i always wondered if hkdiscuz is different from uwants in terms of sentiments.

Click to expand...

ancestral said:

Hi! I've been a lurker on this forum and following this discussion for a while now. I live in Hong Kong, 30, currently a business owner. I'm definitely not a thug or a triad member, and I am also completely against this OC movement.

I think this self-pity (and this movement) has to stop. I accept that you have a cause to fight for, but why demonize all those who are opposed to your point of view? You certainly do not represent 7 million HK people. You'll know if you try to occupy my region. We're all armed and ready to flush you out. When the government cannot secure our livelihood, we'll take matters into our own hands. Democracy sounds good, until you realize the so-called "universal suffrage" won't satisfy the pan-dem and Jimmy Lai. Here's what will happen even if your version of universal suffrage happens:


Pan-dem candidate got elected
Apple Daily and their pan-dem friends will still blame the opposition and central gov't for not helping HK, screwing up things.

Pan-dem candidate lost election
They will of course blame this on the CPC and say the election is rigged.

In conclusion, Jimmy Lai and his pan-dem friends won't rest until they dictate everything. They don't want democracy. They want chaos.

Lastly, here's an audio account of what happened during the first night of Mongkok clash, from the perspective of a police officer. It's a confidential audio sent to me by my friend in the [police] force. I feel compelled to share. Please do me a favor and not let it spread outside of Sinodefence for the time being. It's in Cantonese by the way.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

I hope I didn't violate any forum rules. Peace!

Click to expand...

PanAsian said:

It is not the job of police to protect illegal protesters.

Click to expand...