Latest progress at Hudong:
HD's 1st 054A
Seems like it's ready for launch
HD's 1st 054A
Seems like it's ready for launch
FFG 054/054A Thread
- Thread starter DPRKPTboat
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Í wish to say few things as for final word for this slightly oftopic discussion about morale...
The word brainwash isen't anyway being contradicted here nor has there been any misusing of it. My point was that unlike you stated earlier, political teaching counts almoust nothing when it comes down to indívidual morale.
All militaries have some sort of political teaching and lectioning regardles wheter tehy actually have some sort of political officers. All militaries are the tools and instruments of the current power regime and the dogmas and ideologies of that power regime is made sure for all military personels. It is so in USA, Finland and China. Most of us normal people are basicly quite patriotic from the starting point, its natural to defend your home. Political education in army level is IMO unneccerical and takes too much resources from the actual combat training
For example we finns are teached from kinderkarden level of our forefathers brave strugleling and miracleous achivements in WWII and continued in the army. Still it counts nothnig when you go to the field. In there its all down to the conditions and working supply is the main single factor for it.
I think people tends to mix morale and "sisu" (=guts, balls). No matter how low is your morale, the later is the one that counts in real situations and thats the one that makes you going and not let you quit. Good morale ofcourse improves the overall mood and thus is directly related to your combat ability, but when the enemy comes at your sight, its up to you and your balls wheter you raise your weapon and fire...
But little less morale, little more 054A please
The word brainwash isen't anyway being contradicted here nor has there been any misusing of it. My point was that unlike you stated earlier, political teaching counts almoust nothing when it comes down to indívidual morale.
All militaries have some sort of political teaching and lectioning regardles wheter tehy actually have some sort of political officers. All militaries are the tools and instruments of the current power regime and the dogmas and ideologies of that power regime is made sure for all military personels. It is so in USA, Finland and China. Most of us normal people are basicly quite patriotic from the starting point, its natural to defend your home. Political education in army level is IMO unneccerical and takes too much resources from the actual combat training
For example we finns are teached from kinderkarden level of our forefathers brave strugleling and miracleous achivements in WWII and continued in the army. Still it counts nothnig when you go to the field. In there its all down to the conditions and working supply is the main single factor for it.
I think people tends to mix morale and "sisu" (=guts, balls). No matter how low is your morale, the later is the one that counts in real situations and thats the one that makes you going and not let you quit. Good morale ofcourse improves the overall mood and thus is directly related to your combat ability, but when the enemy comes at your sight, its up to you and your balls wheter you raise your weapon and fire...
But little less morale, little more 054A please
speculator
New Member
525 and 526 are deployed, non of the 54a's are deployed and apparently a 5th ship is in construction, possibly type 54b? (note, the bridge section is a different shape than other 54a's)
couldn't find any pics of the interior though, possibly beacuse to take pictures of them you've got to actually go INTO the ship, which is kinda hard to do for some navy fans with a telescopic lens. This ship is still not fully declassified.
couldn't find any pics of the interior though, possibly beacuse to take pictures of them you've got to actually go INTO the ship, which is kinda hard to do for some navy fans with a telescopic lens. This ship is still not fully declassified.
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speculator, please check this thread first, you would notice that the photos have already been posted. And also, please don't link to Chinese forums, since that really slows down the loading time. either just upload here or upload it to a fast image server.
Dear Sirs:
It seems to me that the older 054's will NOT be converted into 054A's. They may benefit from upgrading of their sensors and weapons, but installation of the VLS system is too radical a move. There is also little space left for it near the bows between the 100 mm gun mount and the bridge.
The PLAN I believe are content to use them as test beds for the hull and engines, controls etc. for the 054A's while maintaining what is basically the sensor and armament fit of their earlier predecessors the Jiangwei II class.
This way technical surprises in the way of performance due to teething problems with the weapons and sensors are eliminated, and testing of the hull form and engines are emphasized.
Hopefully the PLAN will develop an improved (perhaps even vertical-launched!?) version of the HQ-7, with gas-dynamic steering or PIF-PAF. This will be an excellent complement to the Shtil-type missiles systems of the 054A's.
Other possible improvements are a gun-missile variant of the Type 730 CIWS (like the LD-2000 with the box launchers of the TY-90 SAM attached).
The fielding of all three of these systems (combined with a phased-array radar derived from the DDG 170 class) would result in a comprehensive air-and missile defense system.
We can only wait and see.
Best Regards,
Dusky Lim
It seems to me that the older 054's will NOT be converted into 054A's. They may benefit from upgrading of their sensors and weapons, but installation of the VLS system is too radical a move. There is also little space left for it near the bows between the 100 mm gun mount and the bridge.
The PLAN I believe are content to use them as test beds for the hull and engines, controls etc. for the 054A's while maintaining what is basically the sensor and armament fit of their earlier predecessors the Jiangwei II class.
This way technical surprises in the way of performance due to teething problems with the weapons and sensors are eliminated, and testing of the hull form and engines are emphasized.
Hopefully the PLAN will develop an improved (perhaps even vertical-launched!?) version of the HQ-7, with gas-dynamic steering or PIF-PAF. This will be an excellent complement to the Shtil-type missiles systems of the 054A's.
Other possible improvements are a gun-missile variant of the Type 730 CIWS (like the LD-2000 with the box launchers of the TY-90 SAM attached).
The fielding of all three of these systems (combined with a phased-array radar derived from the DDG 170 class) would result in a comprehensive air-and missile defense system.
We can only wait and see.
Best Regards,
Dusky Lim
I agree with duskylim. Not just the space between the launcher and the main gun, but most importantly the weight and the moments that the weight will great if you fit the same VLS system as in 054A. The 054A is the version where the VLS is fitted and if you wish to modernizate the two older 054's, then you would need to recostruct them to similar manners as the A models. That would have to include the 76 mm maingun in place of the 100 mm due the latters bigger weight.
Well I don't know exactly where they are on GE but the two places are
Hudong Shipyard in Shanghai
Huangpu Shipyard in Guangzhou
Go on Global Security it should have it there....
Edit:
Huangpu Shipyard
23°05'N 113°25'E
Changzhou Town, Huangpu District
Guangzhou, Guangdong, China
Post Code: 510336
Tel: 020 2201729
Fax: 020 2201387
Hudong Shipyard.. I think its
31°23'N 121°40'E
Hudong Shipyard in Shanghai
Huangpu Shipyard in Guangzhou
Go on Global Security it should have it there....
Edit:
Huangpu Shipyard
23°05'N 113°25'E
Changzhou Town, Huangpu District
Guangzhou, Guangdong, China
Post Code: 510336
Tel: 020 2201729
Fax: 020 2201387
Hudong Shipyard.. I think its
31°23'N 121°40'E
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This is kind of an interesting picture on Chinese forum. It shows that 054A should have around 6.1m submerged. This is compared to 054's 5.9m submerged (according to the guy who posted). So, there should be at least some increase in displacement.
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