East China Sea Air Defense ID Zone

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Rutim

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Now confirmed officially by the Pacific Fleet Intelligence that China trains for taking Senkaku and islands of the southern and central part of Ryukyu Islands.
 

Blitzo

General
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Now confirmed officially by the Pacific Fleet Intelligence that China trains for taking Senkaku and islands of the southern and central part of Ryukyu Islands.

Now confirmed officially that the Pacific Fleet Intelligence believes China trains for taking Senkaku and islands of the southern and central part of Ryukyu Islands

FTFY

There's a difference between training for a contingency among many and training specifically for a particular situational mission such as taking specific islands, under implication that such an act would be the opening shot (which of course Mr James farrel is assuming for his statement).
Thankfully, those actually in charge are being a little less inflammatory.



Pentagon plays down intelligence officer's provocative China assessment

Feb. 20/14

By Phil Stewart

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Pentagon on Thursday played down remarks by a senior Navy intelligence officer who told a public forum that he believed China was training its forces to be capable of carrying out a "short, sharp" war with Japan in the East China Sea.

The comments by Captain James Fanell, director of intelligence and information operations at the U.S. Pacific Fleet, were little noticed when he made them last week at a conference on maritime strategy called "West 2014" in San Diego. They can be seen here:
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Fanell also predicted China, which declared an air defense zone last year in the East China Sea where it is locked in a territorial dispute with Japan over a string of small islands, would declare another air defense zone by the end of 2015, this time in the South China Sea.

The Pentagon's top spokesman, Rear Admiral John Kirby, declined to comment on whether it was appropriate for Fanell to publicly offer such a blunt assessment, but said the Pentagon wanted closer ties with China's military.

"Those were his views to express," Kirby told a Pentagon news conference.

"What I can tell you about what Secretary Hagel believes is that we all continue to believe that the peaceful, prosperous rise of China is a good thing for the region, for the world," he said, referring to Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel.

Asked whether the Pentagon shared Fanell's assessments, Kirby said it would be inappropriate for him to speak to the intentions or motivations of another country's military.

"It's for China to speak to China's intentions and motivations and their relations with their neighbors. And nothing's changed about our view here," Kirby said.

Ties between China and U.S. ally Japan have worsened due in part to mistrust over China's military buildup and their territorial dispute in the East China Sea.

The U.S. military has refused to recognize the air defense zone China declared last year. Some U.S. officials have warned that any declaration by Beijing of another such zone in the South China Sea could result in changes to U.S. military deployments in the region.

Asked whether Fanell's comments could be a "trial balloon" signaling a possible toughening of the U.S. military posture in the region, Kirby said: "I would refute that absolutely, not a trial balloon."

Fanell, addressing the San Diego forum, said he expected China to declare an air defense zone in the South China Sea in 2014 or 2015.

Fanell said China was expanding training for its navy beyond the "long-standing task to restore Taiwan to the mainland."

"We witnessed the massive amphibious and cross military region exercise, Mission Action 2013, and concluded that the PLA (People's Liberation Army) has been given a new task: To be able to conduct a short, sharp war to destroy Japanese forces in the East China Sea," he said.

He added that such a war could be expected to be followed by a seizure of the islands at the heart of China's territorial dispute with Japan. The islands are known as the Senkaku by Japan and the Diaoyu by China.

(Editing by Mohammad Zargham)



It is always reassuring to read articles that can make stupidity sound dignified.
 

port_08

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Now confirmed officially by the Pacific Fleet Intelligence that China trains for taking Senkaku and islands of the southern and central part of Ryukyu Islands.

I believe in the assessment. China has inherently believed that Diaoyu belongs to them and that is taken away. Any war of sort, there are potential these islands could be annexed. Any lit of fire could bring a military aggression and occupation.

Japan is really in a precarious position because China is rising while Japan is not.

.... if China is an exception then China is indeed a very special nation.

Removed War Drum Comments

The idea that the US has confirmed that the Chinese are planning for war is WRONG. What you have is a single individual speaking his opinion through a non-government Institute. That is all. DO not pick up that ball and run with it.
 
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Rutim

Banned Idiot
lol, it seems like he said to much there. Thanks for this article and especially for the link to the entire panel where he made this remark. I will surely watch it when I'll finally find some free time!
 

Jeff Head

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Registered Member
Now confirmed officially by the Pacific Fleet Intelligence that China trains for taking Senkaku and islands of the southern and central part of Ryukyu Islands.
No, it is not.

The USNI is not an official arm or part of the US Government. I know, I am a member myself.

This Intelligence Officer is not speaking for the government. He is speaking his opinion. Do not try and extrapolate any type of official US government confirmation from something like this...because it is simply not so.

One last time to all posters on this thread:

DO NOT BEAT THE WAR DRUMS

Stop looking for reasons to do so.
 

Miragedriver

Brigadier
A quick question for all you history experts out there. The Diaoyu Islands were not islands that Japan was allowed to keep after WW2 - see list.
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"Japanese sovereignty shall be limited to the islands of Honshu, Hokkaido, Kyushu, Shikoku, and such minor islands as we determine," as had been announced in the Cairo Declaration in 1943.

From what I remember from history the USA held on to the islands after WWII - but the Nixon administration gave Japan administratorship of them in 1971 - in exchange for Japan stopping textile exports to the USA.
So if the islands were under USA administration, and they were then passed to Japan; Dose Japan own the islands, or is there another claim we are not aware of that China has?

PS: I know that wikipiedia is not the best source of information.
 

kwaigonegin

Colonel
A quick question for all you history experts out there. The Diaoyu Islands were not islands that Japan was allowed to keep after WW2 - see list.
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"Japanese sovereignty shall be limited to the islands of Honshu, Hokkaido, Kyushu, Shikoku, and such minor islands as we determine," as had been announced in the Cairo Declaration in 1943.

From what I remember from history the USA held on to the islands after WWII - but the Nixon administration gave Japan administratorship of them in 1971 - in exchange for Japan stopping textile exports to the USA.
So if the islands were under USA administration, and they were then passed to Japan; Dose Japan own the islands, or is there another claim we are not aware of that China has?

PS: I know that wikipiedia is not the best source of information.

Thus the gray area we now have today. Both sides have their opinions and for the most part both sides have credibility in their own right. This is what happens when things are not signed sealed and delivered in absolute black and white!

i'm not a big fan of major powers holding on to land that isn't historically theirs. Either take the darn thing over claim it as your own or give the dirt back to the natives. Anything in between will just cause rift down the road if not now definitely future generations to come.

The European powers (British empire the worst) did a lot of these back in the day and I genuinely believe that a lot of issues happening in the world in the past, present and most likely future is in large part stemmed from the policies and administration of these powers with their land grabbing, power sharing and what nots they did with each other or with certain local tribes etc during their colonization.
Ok enough OT rant from me.
 

solarz

Brigadier
A quick question for all you history experts out there. The Diaoyu Islands were not islands that Japan was allowed to keep after WW2 - see list.
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

"Japanese sovereignty shall be limited to the islands of Honshu, Hokkaido, Kyushu, Shikoku, and such minor islands as we determine," as had been announced in the Cairo Declaration in 1943.

From what I remember from history the USA held on to the islands after WWII - but the Nixon administration gave Japan administratorship of them in 1971 - in exchange for Japan stopping textile exports to the USA.
So if the islands were under USA administration, and they were then passed to Japan; Dose Japan own the islands, or is there another claim we are not aware of that China has?

PS: I know that wikipiedia is not the best source of information.

Simple, the Diaoyu Islands were never USA's to give away in the first place. They may have had administrative control over them, but never had sovereignty.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Guys, we have been over this time and again.

This thread is not about the Diaoyu/Senkakus Islands. Talk about the Islands leads to arguements on both sides.

This thread is about the ADIZ that China has set up in that part of the China Sea. Talking about the aircraft they use to patrol it, talk about how other nations, both commercially and militarily view it and operate within it, specific intercepts/incidents, the technology involved in all of that...all of these are rfair game for this thread.

But back and forth about the Islands themselves is not. As has been stated earlier, limit your discussions to the ADIZ or the thread will be closed.

THIS HAS ALREADY BEEN POSTED ON THIS THREAD

See :

PRIOR MODERATOR'S INSTRUCTIONS

Abide by these instructions. It is the same posters (pretty much) each time and I am losing my patience. Next time this occurs and ths Island dispute becomes the point of discussion on this ADIZ thread, there will be more suspensions of those involved.

Thanks.
 
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Franklin

Captain
For all you warmongers here this article will show you what's really happening behind the scenes in China Japan relations. Despite all the bluster and threats on both sides the economic relations between the two countries is booming.

The Madness of Abenomics In One (Crazy) Chart

There are two areas where Abenomics, the democratically elected economic religion of Japan, has succeeded: creating inflation without causing wages to rise, thus whittling down real incomes; and devaluing the yen by 25%, thus wiping out a quarter of the magnificent wealth of the Japanese without telling them directly. Grudging admiration is due Prime Minister Shinzo Abe for these accomplishments.

But in other areas, his record is spotty. One of the goals of watering down the yen is to goose exports by making them cheaper overseas and reduce imports by making them more expensive to consumers and businesses at home. It would crank up manufacturing and lead to a glorious trade surplus that would inflate GDP, turn Abe into a hero, and save Japan. That was the plan.

That plan has gone to heck. Not in small increments over the years, but in relentless month-to-month leaps whose viciousness surprised even the deep cynic in me.

So exports in January, at ¥5.25 trillion, rose 9.5% from a year earlier, the Ministry of Finance reported. Alas, it was only about half the rate at which the yen had been devalued over the 12-month period, and so by volume, exports dropped.

But Imports, which should have dropped as they’re getting more expensive due to the watered-down yen, soared 25% to ¥8.04 trillion. Japanese businesses and consumers had gone on a buying spree of goods made in China and elsewhere.

The resulting trade deficit skyrocketed 70.8% to ¥2.79 trillion. It was the worst trade deficit ever. It was almost twice as bad as the prior “worst deficit ever,” recorded in January 2013. In January 2010, Japan still had a trade surplus of ¥43 billion! It was the 19th month in a row of trade deficits, the worst such sequence since anyone started counting, worse even than the 14-month series in 1979-1980.

It was the sequel of a relentless deterioration: As the January trade deficit had been the worst January ever, December had been the worst December ever, November the worst November ever, October the worst... an unbroken series of deterioration all the way through 2011. The madness of Abenomics in one crazy chart:

But don’t blame the shutdown of nuclear reactors. Sure, Japan has to import more liquefied natural gas and coal for power generation to make up for the loss of nuclear power. So the value of LNG imports rose 21.4% year over year – or ¥129.8 billion, largely due to the devaluation of the currency, not increased use of LNG. And the value of coal imports rose 14.8%, or ¥26.8 billion. Combined, ¥156.6 billion. Without that increase, the trade deficit would have been ¥2.63 trillion instead of ¥2.79 trillion. It wouldn’t have changed anything. It would still be by far the worst trade deficit ever.

And Japan doesn’t import LNG and coal from China, but it is with China that the trade deficit has exploded. Despite the well-orchestrated display of annoyance and aggression on both sides, Japan and China are joined at the hip through trade, and China is Japan’s largest trading partner.

To cut through the fog surrounding exports to China, a quarter of which are transshipped through Hong Kong, I combine the trade figures for China and Hong Kong. Exports to both reached ¥1.1 trillion, up 8.8% – less than half the rate of the devaluation of the yen! But imports from China and Hong Kong soared 34.0% to a record ¥1.92 trillion. Once upon a time, Japan was one of the few major countries that had trade surpluses with China. But in January, the trade deficit with China and Hong Kong nearly doubled to ¥826 billion.

Where was the damage? Imports of manufactured goods, such as iron and steel products, soared 29% from a year earlier. Imports of machinery, including computers: up 37.4%. Electrical machinery, including semiconductors, audiovisual equipment, and telecommunications equipment: up 33.7%. Transportation equipment: up 41.0%. Japanese companies used to excel in these categories. While some have gotten run over by international competition, others still excel at designing and making these products. They just manufacture them overseas.


Japanese companies have long shifted production offshore to take advantage of cheap labor, though they’ve been lagging behind their US counterparts. But since the earthquake in March 2011, they’ve gone on an offshoring binge to diversify their supply chains that had bogged down, and to escape electricity constraints, rising rates, and rolling blackouts in the wake of the Fukushima fiasco. They’re also locating production plants closer to their customers in their largest markets, particularly China, and particularly in the auto industry.

Now they have another reason: translating profits from foreign operations into the devalued yen applies a thick layer of glossy lipstick to their income statements – and the markets are blinded by this form of illusory sex appeal.

What these Japanese heroes are not doing is repatriating their foreign profits. They understand the fact of Abenomics; they don’t want to see their capital get demolished in the devaluation. Hence, these funds stay overseas, are reinvested overseas, and are spent overseas. The Japanese economy ends up holding the bag. That too is part of the madness of Abenomics.

So, Kudos to the Bank of Japan. Its heroic money-printing campaign has borne fruit. The people may not have noticed how much of their wealth has gone up in smoke, but they’re noticing other things.

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