Crisis in the Ukraine

Strangely enough, I was born in an ex British colony in Asia that gained independence and had democracy since day 1. In my 50s I chose to live full time in the land of the Great Yellow Peril, where mass social protests regularly takes place, where the people are oppressed in everyway possible, no free speech is allowed, religions suppressed. I am into my second year living in what western media has described as "hell" and renewing for my 3rd year.

I write frequently on Facebook to my friends back in my home country telling of my great times living here, freedom of movement, visits to places of religious activities, how real crime is much lower than back home, personal safety better than back home, people here talk to the local police where we don't do that back home, police don't carry guns not even handcuffs or walkie talkies.

Here you can buy a fridge and have it delivered within an hour. Talk about efficiency! People are serious about business and service! Plus no tipping culture and still great service in restaurants!
That's the reality that you don't see western media writing about.

I must be telling lies then since western media always tell the real truth.

solarz said:

That's the problem with labels. I too, lived under "communism" and didn't experience any oppression whatsoever. 1.4 billion people continue to live under "communism" and manage to lead fulfilling lives.

A great author once wrote: "If someone starts talking about Good and Evil, you better keep a hand on your wallet."

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Jura said:

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Well that is interesting.
The basic premise basically that since the gulf of the narrative (or indeed the facts) as put out by the West and those put out by Russia is so vast, that only a Russian media and information warping of reality of hallucinogenic proportions can explain the discrepancy.

Well actually there is another explanation that requires considerably less effort by the Russians to explain the same gulf....


Unfortunately for the author, we have just come out of several months where we have been able to test the narratives of both sides against hard reality and the authors version is not the one that emerges with credibility.

Map of the ceasefire as of yesterday direct from kot_ivanov

So what do the purple areas mean? Did the rebels pull back from their encirclement of Mariupol, or were they forced back? Is the ceasefire still in effect?

From what I have read the separatists don't have a real encirclement on the west side of Mariupol. They have roving recon units to harass lightly escorted traffic but not in any real strong strength to close off the road west.

solarz said:

So what do the purple areas mean? Did the rebels pull back from their encirclement of Mariupol, or were they forced back? Is the ceasefire still in effect?

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solarz said:

So what do the purple areas mean? Did the rebels pull back from their encirclement of Mariupol, or were they forced back? Is the ceasefire still in effect?

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The Cease fire is holding it seems.

The mauve areas are where Ukrainian forces are regrouping and concentrating.
It also seems clear that the Novorossians have pulled back from some of their more exposed frontal positions.
Not really a surprise, it is one thing to be out way ahead when the enemy is in a disorganised rout and quite another when they are able to collect themselves again.
As Saker pointed out, if the NAF over stretch themselves around the South, they would face the same end as similarly over extended Ukrainian forces.

It also seems that the big cauldron to the South West has managed to unblock itself. I would imagine that most of the encircled units would be seeing to extricate themselves while the ceasefire holds. I think the NAF would be only too pleased to see them go.

And the shelling of Donetsk goes on. What truce? Must be the separatists shelling Donetsk to frame Kiev! Dirty separatists tricks!!



The SMM in Donetsk on 8 September, between 20:21 and 21:14 hrs recorded the sound of eight to ten instances of outgoing shelling which appeared to have originated both from the west and the north of the city centre. At 01:35hrs the SMM heard sounds consistent with the detonation of heavy mortar rounds which appeared to have originated from the airport area. The shelling continued for nearly two minutes with short intervals.

On 9 September in Kievski district, to the north of Donetsk city centre, local residents told the SMM that the area had been shelled since Friday night, and persistently in the following days, by an unspecified number of howitzer artillery pieces and “Grad” missiles. According to local inhabitants, five men have died as a result of the impacts and many others were injured. The SMM could not independently verify this information.

Success!! Kiev has killed more than 2,000 Russian soldiers and wounded more than 8,000!! No wonder Russian troops has ran back across the borders!!

solarz said:

That's the problem with labels. I too, lived under "communism" and didn't experience any oppression whatsoever. 1.4 billion people continue to live under "communism" and manage to lead fulfilling lives.

A great author once wrote: "If someone starts talking about Good and Evil, you better keep a hand on your wallet."

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well solarz, you are something of a hypocrite posting about the problems with labels and then labeling your unnamed author, "A Great Author". He's great according to you, but you don't like labels.....

Lets take a short test shall we????? Between the Journalist and the Jihadest, which one is good the Journalist or the Jihadist???????? did you answer???? Good, now the second question is much easier,,,,, which one is evil?????? the Journalist or the Jihadist???????

Let me guess, you couldn't answer either one could you, or you won't publicly?????? or will you????????

before you get out your dagger, I do hope you at least have one of those, I am using the term "hypocrite" in its literal sense, saying one thing, and then doing something that's different than what you said. I am NOT calling you a name, but I do believe that you espoused one belief, and then applied another????

Now, that applies to the Ukrainian situation in this way, lots of people are saying lots of things on this thread, on the Sino Defense Forum, and then they are proving by their actions, that their statement do not reflect their actual beliefs????? In fact I myself may have done so???? inadvertently??????

Let me say that I like you, and I have given you likes on the many posts you have spoken that I agree with, or at least understood your point and thought you made it well, and my apologies if you might have the initial impression that I was criticizing you, I am not. My point is that we "all" label people and actions according to our own set of values, and we all have those, seared into our conscious or unconscious thoughts, and in spite of our best efforts to be totally neutral or objective, we are likely to bring those values into our decision making????

and of course I am talking about James Foley and his Killer, hiding in the black mask.

Jura said:

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awesome article, and it explains so much.... thanks brat

Miragedriver said:

Point noted. However, I am an old “Cold Warrior” and many of us on this forum have had to live under “communism” and it is very different than living in the “West”. It compares to the Evil vs Good concept if you have ever been oppressed.


Bottling my Malbec in freedom from Communism

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and I the son of cold-warrior, my Dad warned me that "communists" would report their neighbors to the friendly local party chiefs, in order to gain favor and improve their standing within the "party", I see many in this country (US), now doing the same thing and it troubles me. The party chiefs would then "punish" the folks who their neighbors reported, and reward the folks who expressed their loyalty to the party by "exposing" their neighbors....

A free society however is based on trust, you trust your neighbor to do the right thing---- I will say this, I never saw my Dad betray a confidence, or take andvantage of another man, he may have???? but I don't think so, and I only saw one or two men, betray the "trust" that my Dad had placed in them. My Dad got the best out of people because he always gave them his best, my Dad tried to help everybody, and he tried to respect everybody, but he did tell the truth, and the worst "whipping", I ever received was for stealing, and then lying about it. He abhorred lies, and liars.........so yes there are good and evil, and its really not that difficult to tell which is which....