Coronavirus 2019-2020 thread (no unsubstantiated rumours!)

[MortyandRick]

The emphasis has always been on how Chinese health care lags behind US, Japan, etc… therefore zero Covid must be kept to prevent millions of death in densely populated Chinese cities and thus overwhelm the healthcare system. That was the justification for Zero Covid. Read the last 20 pages.

Now, all of sudden it has “all the data it needs” to take care of “exacerbated Covid”. Not much has changed except Xi decided to loosen zero Covid after the party Congress.

It's because covid also has evolved to be less lethal with higher transmission rate. But this new variant that's come out may be a bit more lethal and they are not sure so the policy is kind of going back and forth.

It's hard to open up during the winter time as other disease flare as well

 

[Petrolicious88]

It's because covid also has evolved to be less lethal with higher transmission rate. But this new variant that's come out may be a bit more lethal and they are not sure so the policy is kind of going back and forth.

It's hard to open up during the winter time as other disease flare as well

There will always be a new variant. It's going to evolve with us. Certain subsets of the population will always be vulnerable due to preexisting conditions, genetics, etc... if you are going to rely on lockdowns to prevent infections (esp. past policies where entire cities went into lockdown after just a few infections), you will be in and out of lockdowns forever.

You either learn to live with it (vaccination, masking, basic social distancing, lifestyle routines that keep the innate immune system healthy) or find a silver bullet that can completely eradicate it.

 

[daifo]

The thing is, now we have a good idea on how to treat covid, what it's longer term consequences are and how people need to be protected.

Armed with this knowledge that was earned through sweat and blood by foreigners, China can open up freely while remaining mostly safe.

Of course now is the start of covid season, so its dumb to open right at this moment. But come spring or even by CNY, by that time we will likely see return to business as usual for the whole country.

Its peak covid season in the West because of holiday travel and festivities. Mix in covid, cold and flu... It might not be the same for China (not sure how big xmas is) if they don't share the similar activities and still close off to the world. CNY would be the equvalent of the US thanksgiving to new years session.

 

[daifo]

It's because covid also has evolved to be less lethal with higher transmission rate. But this new variant that's come out may be a bit more lethal and they are not sure so the policy is kind of going back and forth.

It's hard to open up during the winter time as other disease flare as well

The rest of the world has culled their "prone to die from covid" via millions of deaths, we have to remember that China has not gone thru that yet. I believe nearly 1000-2000 Americans still die a week from covid with this "weaker" strain.

 

[Petrolicious88]

Its peak covid season in the West because of holiday travel and festivities. Mix in covid, cold and flu... It might not be the same for China (not sure how big xmas is) if they don't share the similar activities and still close off to the world. CNY would be the equvalent of the US thanksgiving to new years session.

Covid outbreak started during Trump presidency; in Wuhan of all places, and during CNY when millions were traveling across the country (how convenient). If you are into conspiracy theories, then watch what happens during this CNY.

 

[MortyandRick]

There will always be a new variant. It's going to evolve with us. Certain subsets of the population will always be vulnerable due to preexisting conditions, genetics, etc... if you are going to rely on lockdowns to prevent infections (esp. past policies where entire cities went into lockdown after just a few infections), you will be in and out of lockdowns forever.

You either learn to live with it (vaccination, masking, basic social distancing, lifestyle routines that keep the innate immune system healthy) or find a silver bullet that can completely eradicate it.

Yes of course certain population will be vulnerable, but that's why one has to open slowly and not open the flood gates right away. Otherwise the strain on the health care system is too large.

Give China's 1.4 billion population, even if it's 1% of population the numbers are astronomical. Easily overwhelm the health system .

They should try to mitigate and not lock down completely but opening up quickly will be the wrong answer. Do you know how many hospitals are at the brink in North America? I can tell you from experience that it's a lot.

And also what do you suggest people do
improve our innate immune system enough to completely prevent disease prey tell? Cause Id love to tell this to people.

 

[getready]

Looks like you guys have also given up on covid and pretend covid doesn't exist anymore?
We have the exact same here in the Netherlands.

I believe Its the same pretty much everywhere outside mainland China and maybe some Asian countries. I talked to friends and relatives in France, US, Canada, UK. most western countries not only decided to live with the virus but many believe two dose vaccination is either enough already or they are sham gov conspiracy, long covid is nothing, masking is stupid, economy is more important than vulnerable lives.

Here, we have dropped all restrictions like social distancing and masking. Almost everyone except minority of people including me still taking it seriously. I don't know our numbers for boosters vaccine but it's gotta be low, most people stopped at first two shots. Studies suggest about half of the population already had covid and this was months ago. Last month a cruise ship of 800 covid positive passengers was allowed to dock here with little to no precautionary measures.

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Now we are expecting to head to yet another covid wave,

 

[Biscuits]

The emphasis has always been on how Chinese health care lags behind US, Japan, etc… therefore zero Covid must be kept to prevent millions of death in densely populated Chinese cities and thus overwhelm the healthcare system. That was the justification for Zero Covid. Read the last 20 pages.

Now, all of sudden it has “all the data it needs” to take care of “exacerbated Covid”. Not much has changed except Xi decided to loosen zero Covid after the party Congress.

I've never once said that, if that is an emphasis from others, it is a wrongful one.

Having a higher life expectancy than USA although perhaps lower than some EU countries show that while the healthcare might lag behind Japan or Sweden to some extent, it is defintely ahead of America at least.

Justification of 0 covid is, we avoid mass deaths especially among those who are otherwise healthy. Also, we buy time for better medicines, better understanding of the virus and how to treat the most vulnerable that get difficult cases of covid.

If both points are achieved then the mission is over. And I believe we are close to that point.

 

[manqiangrexue]

For how long will the chinese government will continue with this policy?

Until the guinea pig West has shown nearly no more deaths from COVID. That means that the strain has evolved to truly become a mild flu.

if the problem is inadequate chinese vaccines, then china should import from moderna or other western vaccine makers. The economic and social cost of continuing this policy far outweights the cost of importing vaccines.

Those Western vaccines got the US to 2,600 deaths a week. China has 1... from an 87 year old man with comorbidities. China should buy what now? LOL

 

[Bellum_Romanum]

For how long will the chinese government will continue with this policy? if the problem is inadequate chinese vaccines, then china should import from moderna or other western vaccine makers. The economic and social cost of continuing this policy far outweights the cost of importing vaccines.

Man, shut up