Chinese semiconductor thread II

Overbom

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Dutch will comply with US demands for controls on servicing ASML equipment.

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For every denied/delayed service of a ASML equipment in China, China promises to send 100000 shells, 10000 drones, and 500 cruise missiles to Russia. Problem solved

In a more serious note, China (Chinese customers of ASML) should ask for damages in court. Mind you, these damages should be for breach of contact, depreciation, opportunity cost, and money lost due to decreased yield or output of the chips produced. All that combined could probably go at 2-digit billion number. In addition to that, China (the state) should take retaliatory actions against Netherlands.

IP patents (official) voidance is a thing best left untouched for now
 

tphuang

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Dutch will comply with US demands for controls on servicing ASML equipment.

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it actually doesn't say that. The author thinks that Dutch will comply. these are big differences. I do agree with the assessment that Dutch enforcement of this will be like the Japanese one where some will be accepted and others will be declined
 

european_guy

Junior Member
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it actually doesn't say that. The author thinks that Dutch will comply. these are big differences. I do agree with the assessment that Dutch enforcement of this will be like the Japanese one where some will be accepted and others will be declined

I agree. I've read the article. It is the same one-week-old news of a visit next Monday of US officials in Holland to push for ASML to stop service in China.

At the moment it is just US media pumping up this stuff, but nothing effective yet. Last time, one year ago, it was needed a top meeting at White House between Holland PM and Biden to have some real effect, and a very slow one BTW, because actual restrictions on ASML kicked in almost one year later. I really don't think this delegation will come back home with anything but some lip service from Ducth officials.

The biggest leverage US has in this thing is that Holland PM Rutte, is candidate to become the next NATO secretary, a position formally chosen by NATO members, but in reality chosen by US. This is of course a big bargain chip....for both sides, US and Rutte itself...and ASML could be the one to pay for US and Rutte interests.

Nevertheless China should of course already plan for the worst. In a perfect world, one can envision a spin-off of ASML China in an independent company, with a good chunk of Chinese shareholders brought in. But we don't live in a perfect world, and US would never agree on this, even if ASML itself maybe would: it is one of the very few ways for ASML not being kicked out of China market in the long term and maybe it would even make business sense in a semiconductor decoupling scenario, that is where we are heading to at full speed.
 

tphuang

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I agree. I've read the article. It is the same one-week-old news of a visit next Monday of US officials in Holland to push for ASML to stop service in China.

At the moment it is just US media pumping up this stuff, but nothing effective yet. Last time, one year ago, it was needed a top meeting at White House between Holland PM and Biden to have some real effect, and a very slow one BTW, because actual restrictions on ASML kicked in almost one year later. I really don't think this delegation will come back home with anything but some lip service from Ducth officials.

The biggest leverage US has in this thing is that Holland PM Rutte, is candidate to become the next NATO secretary, a position formally chosen by NATO members, but in reality chosen by US. This is of course a big bargain chip....for both sides, US and Rutte itself...and ASML could be the one to pay for US and Rutte interests.

Nevertheless China should of course already plan for the worst. In a perfect world, one can envision a spin-off of ASML China in an independent company, with a good chunk of Chinese shareholders brought in. But we don't live in a perfect world, and US would never agree on this, even if ASML itself maybe would: it is one of the very few ways for ASML not being kicked out of China market in the long term and maybe it would even make business sense in a semiconductor decoupling scenario, that is where we are heading to at full speed.
basically, ASML is threatening to move out of Netherlands right now, so Dutch gov't doesn't exactly have all the leverages. ASML can move to France or Italy or Germany and the Dutch will be crushed. Since we are just talking about servicing here, which doesn't require American technology, there are definitely ways they can get around things if ASML wanted to
 
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