@BlackWindMnt thanks bro for explaining it in layman terms, so if SMIC start using SMEE DUVL, they need to retrain and start from scratch all the procedure since the machine is different so is the software? or SMIC need to work and coordinate with SMEE producing a hybrid of western with local EDA since they had the experience of using it? From what I know TSMC and ASML had this cooperation to smooth out their operation that is the reason for their current dominance.
Chinese semiconductor industry
- Thread starter Hendrik_2000
- Start date
- Status
I think the closest comparison I can make with EDA software are probably software compilers. A compiler is a program suite that accept lines of code and translate it to machine instructions(ARM, RISV-V, X86-64 etc). Modern compilers usually have multiple components.
Usually you have a front end component that generates generic machine code. And a backend component which uses the generic machine code to generate specific machine code for lets say the ARM architecture. Usually a manufacturer needs to create those back end components or work together with the opensource community to get it done.
My best guess is EDA software does the same for circuit designers, the front end of the EDA program changes it to a generic instructions and then the different semi conductor machine manufacturers create their own specific backend that creates specific instructions for their machines.
As you can see there are quiet some steps and translations going on, this all needs to standardized and implemented at break neck speed at the moment. EDA software creators need to talk with SMEE to agree on a standardized output SMEE needs to agree with others to see what their needs are.
Or they could just say we are going to use already standardized outputs and designs because it war mode right now. When we are out of this self created shit hole we can start domesticate those standards. Because talking about standards can take months if not years to crystalize.
PS: Im not familiar with EDA software branch of programming, so just talking from past experiences when i still had a gig in the financial sector and had to join those boring ass standards meeting.
Congress or Us presidents can ban if they wish.nahhh, nobody could ban RISC-V, thats the beauty of it .. the US could be the laughing stock of the world if they try
Yes, the only creativity left for the US is in lawfare .... as the brightest mind of Americans in the US study laws and stock market, no longer in STEM
Huawei patent is quite useless if US decide huawei patent is invalidated.
@BlackWindMnt thanks bro, from my recollect (can't find the attachment from this thread ) and I think @WTAN can help me out, that Huawei had an EDA ready for 7nm chips together with 28nm DUVL that is funded under the 13th 5year plan, that info came from A-SET and he provided details about China DUVL and EUVL development.
Last edited:
I don't think EDA have connections with lithography machine. EDA for IC designs, simulation, analysis etc. Normally, after finishing designs on EDA they will transfer to photo mask. So photo mask company need to discuss with SMEE on standard.
I am sure there will eventually be some deals done when Huaweis FAB gets set up.
Huawei will get their Tech mainly from ICRD/Huahong which already have small scale 14nm FINFET Production. Maybe ICRD can do their own 7nm later.
But Huawei will certainly get some help somewhere, as all this R&D involves substantial amounts of money.
Huawei has to develop its own EDA or use a local EDA as it is under sanctions. It cant get the latest versions of the foreign EDA that it has been using all along.
Huawei supposedly developed its own EDA as part of the 02 Special Project.
Do Huawei also do/assist development of equipment? It seems deep capital and expertise can be really helpful here.
@horse Bro from your buddy MOTIF of China Military Forum Not going to translate, just highlight a few key points.
华为武汉芯片工厂进入产线调试，将实现芯片从设计到封测全自主cocoshell 椰子小贝壳*暖暖春日 昨天 16:48 字数 1831 
数据显示，武汉华为光工厂项目地处武汉光谷的中心部位，总建筑面积高达20.89万平方米，建设的内容包括FAB生产厂房、CUB动力站、PMD软件工厂及其一系列的配套设施。该工厂是迄今为止华为在我国中部地区最大的研发基地，该工厂的重点主要放在光能力中心、智能终端研发中心等前沿科技等方面。 据相关的消息得知，此项目建成之后，将会成为华为国内的第一个芯片厂房并开始投入生产（主要职能就是为华为生产其自研的通信芯片及其模组），并将在很大程度上助力华为实现自己构建万物互联智能世界的愿景。将让华为真正的实现芯片从设计到制造、封装测试以及转化到消费市场的一套完整的产业链。 令人感到欣慰的是，该工厂将会由我国一家总部设在上海的研发公司直接代表华为来进行管理，并且也不会使用任何来自美国的技术！按照相关的计划，该工厂将会在2021年的年底开始生产45nm制程的芯片组，并且将会采用28 nm的光刻技术来完成。发展达到预期的话，还将在2022年实现20nm以下的工艺，制造专门服务于华为旗下电信部门的真正的国产芯片。 华为作为全球通信设备市场的佼佼者，其在创立之初就已经将眼光放在，布局光通信领域核心器件的光芯片上。从2012华为收购来自英国的CIP光子集成公司，再到2013年华为收购比利时硅光技术开发商Caliopa公司。均可以看出华为对于进入了光通信芯片市场的长远布局。到现在为止，华为对光通信芯片等方面的投入已经有六年之久，并且到现在已经实现了部分产品的自主研发和生产。特别是在光芯片(包含25G EML)、调制器、硅光(SiP)、DSP等许多领域都已经达到了自产用的技术能力。除此之外，华为也掌握了当前全球最为先进的800G光芯片的相关技术。 随着美国对我国科技企业不断加大“打压”力度，我国的科技企业都在奋力前进。尤其是华为的近期行动更值得让人敬畏，按照之前华为公布的募集说明书上的消息得知。在2019年的6月底之前，华为对外公布的在建工程就高达5项，其中就包含贵安的华为云数据中心项目、华为岗头人才公寓项目、华为的苏州研发项目以及华为的松山湖终端项目二期和松山湖华为培训学院等，计划在建的项目为：上海青浦研发、武汉海思工厂项目（也就是武汉华为光工厂的项目），这两个项目的总投资分别高达109.85亿元和18亿元。 |
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Via xyz
Huawei's Wuhan chip factory enters trial production and will realize full autonomy from chip design to packaging and testing
椰子小贝壳*暖暖春日 昨天 16:48 字数 183
The data shows that the Wuhan Huawei Optical Factory project is located in the center of Wuhan Optics Valley, with a total construction area of up to 208,900 square meters. The construction content includes FAB production plant, CUB power station, PMD software factory and a series of supporting facilities. The factory is by far the largest R&D base of Huawei in central my country. The focus of the factory is mainly on cutting-edge technologies such as the optical capability center and the intelligent terminal R&D center.
According to related news, after the completion of this project, it will become Huawei’s first chip factory in China and start production (the main function is to produce its self-developed communication chips and modules for Huawei), and it will be launched soon. To a large extent, it helps Huawei realize its vision of building a smart world with all things connected. It will enable Huawei to truly realize a complete industrial chain from design to manufacturing, packaging and testing, and conversion to the consumer market.
It is gratifying that the factory will be managed by a Chinese R&D company headquartered in Shanghai directly on behalf of Huawei, and will not use any technology from the United States! According to related plans, the factory will start producing 45nm process chipsets at the end of 2021, and will use 28nm lithography technology to complete. If the development reaches expectations, it will also achieve a process below 20nm in 2022 to manufacture genuine domestic chips dedicated to Huawei's telecommunications department.
As a leader in the global communications equipment market, Huawei has set its sights on the deployment of optical chips for core devices in the optical communications field at the beginning of its establishment. From 2012 Huawei acquired CIP Photonics Integration from the United Kingdom, and then in 2013 Huawei acquired the Belgian silicon optical technology developer Caliopa. It can be seen that Huawei's long-term layout for entering the optical communication chip market. Up to now, Huawei has invested in optical communication chips and other aspects for six years, and has now achieved independent research and development and production of some products. Especially in many fields such as optical chips (including 25G EML), modulators, silicon photonics (SiP), DSP, etc., they have reached the technical capabilities for self-production. In addition, Huawei has also mastered the world's most advanced 800G optical chip related technology.
As the United States continues to increase its "suppression" on Chinese technology companies, domestic technology companies are struggling to advance. In particular, Huawei's recent actions are more awe-inspiring, according to the information in the prospectus announced by Huawei. Before the end of June 2019, Huawei announced as many as 5 projects under construction, including Gui'an's Huawei Cloud Data Center Project, Huawei Gangtou Talent Apartment Project, Huawei's Suzhou R&D Project, and Huawei's Songshan Lake Terminal The second phase of the project and the Songshan Lake Huawei Training Academy. The planned projects are: Shanghai Qingpu R&D and Wuhan Haisi Factory Project (that is, the project of Wuhan Huawei Optical Factory). The total investment of these two projects is as high as 10.985 billion yuan. And 1.8 billion yuan.
华为武汉芯片工厂进入产线调试，将实现芯片从设计到封测全自主
椰子小贝壳*暖暖春日 昨天 16:48 字数 183
数据显示，武汉华为光工厂项目地处武汉光谷的中心部位，总建筑面积高达20.89万平方米，建设的内容包括FAB生产厂房、CUB动力站、PMD软件工厂及其一系列的配套设施。该工厂是迄今为止华为在我国中部地区最大的研发基地，该工厂的重点主要放在光能力中心、智能终端研发中心等前沿科技等方面。
据相关的消息得知，此项目建成之后，将会成为华为国内的第一个芯片厂房并开始投入生产（主要职能就是为华为生产其自研的通信芯片及其模组），并将在很大程度上助力华为实现自己构建万物互联智能世界的愿景。将让华为真正的实现芯片从设计到制造、封装测试以及转化到消费市场的一套完整的产业链。
令人感到欣慰的是，该工厂将会由我国一家总部设在上海的研发公司直接代表华为来进行管理，并且也不会使用任何来自美国的技术！按照相关的计划，该工厂将会在2021年的年底开始生产45nm制程的芯片组，并且将会采用28 nm的光刻技术来完成。发展达到预期的话，还将在2022年实现20nm以下的工艺，制造专门服务于华为旗下电信部门的真正的国产芯片。
华为作为全球通信设备市场的佼佼者，其在创立之初就已经将眼光放在，布局光通信领域核心器件的光芯片上。从2012华为收购来自英国的CIP光子集成公司，再到2013年华为收购比利时硅光技术开发商Caliopa公司。均可以看出华为对于进入了光通信芯片市场的长远布局。到现在为止，华为对光通信芯片等方面的投入已经有六年之久，并且到现在已经实现了部分产品的自主研发和生产。特别是在光芯片(包含25G EML)、调制器、硅光(SiP)、DSP等许多领域都已经达到了自产用的技术能力。除此之外，华为也掌握了当前全球最为先进的800G光芯片的相关技术。
随着美国对我国科技企业不断加大“打压”力度，我国的科技企业都在奋力前进。尤其是华为的近期行动更值得让人敬畏，按照之前华为公布的募集说明书上的消息得知。在2019年的6月底之前，华为对外公布的在建工程就高达5项，其中就包含贵安的华为云数据中心项目、华为岗头人才公寓项目、华为的苏州研发项目以及华为的松山湖终端项目二期和松山湖华为培训学院等，计划在建的项目为：上海青浦研发、武汉海思工厂项目（也就是武汉华为光工厂的项目），这两个项目的总投资分别高达109.85亿元和18亿元。
« Last Edit: Today at 06:00:32 AM by xyz »
Huawei's Wuhan chip factory enters trial production and will realize full autonomy from chip design to packaging and testing
椰子小贝壳*暖暖春日 昨天 16:48 字数 183
The data shows that the Wuhan Huawei Optical Factory project is located in the center of Wuhan Optics Valley, with a total construction area of up to 208,900 square meters. The construction content includes FAB production plant, CUB power station, PMD software factory and a series of supporting facilities. The factory is by far the largest R&D base of Huawei in central my country. The focus of the factory is mainly on cutting-edge technologies such as the optical capability center and the intelligent terminal R&D center.
According to related news, after the completion of this project, it will become Huawei’s first chip factory in China and start production (the main function is to produce its self-developed communication chips and modules for Huawei), and it will be launched soon. To a large extent, it helps Huawei realize its vision of building a smart world with all things connected. It will enable Huawei to truly realize a complete industrial chain from design to manufacturing, packaging and testing, and conversion to the consumer market.
It is gratifying that the factory will be managed by a Chinese R&D company headquartered in Shanghai directly on behalf of Huawei, and will not use any technology from the United States! According to related plans, the factory will start producing 45nm process chipsets at the end of 2021, and will use 28nm lithography technology to complete. If the development reaches expectations, it will also achieve a process below 20nm in 2022 to manufacture genuine domestic chips dedicated to Huawei's telecommunications department.
As a leader in the global communications equipment market, Huawei has set its sights on the deployment of optical chips for core devices in the optical communications field at the beginning of its establishment. From 2012 Huawei acquired CIP Photonics Integration from the United Kingdom, and then in 2013 Huawei acquired the Belgian silicon optical technology developer Caliopa. It can be seen that Huawei's long-term layout for entering the optical communication chip market. Up to now, Huawei has invested in optical communication chips and other aspects for six years, and has now achieved independent research and development and production of some products. Especially in many fields such as optical chips (including 25G EML), modulators, silicon photonics (SiP), DSP, etc., they have reached the technical capabilities for self-production. In addition, Huawei has also mastered the world's most advanced 800G optical chip related technology.
As the United States continues to increase its "suppression" on Chinese technology companies, domestic technology companies are struggling to advance. In particular, Huawei's recent actions are more awe-inspiring, according to the information in the prospectus announced by Huawei. Before the end of June 2019, Huawei announced as many as 5 projects under construction, including Gui'an's Huawei Cloud Data Center Project, Huawei Gangtou Talent Apartment Project, Huawei's Suzhou R&D Project, and Huawei's Songshan Lake Terminal The second phase of the project and the Songshan Lake Huawei Training Academy. The planned projects are: Shanghai Qingpu R&D and Wuhan Haisi Factory Project (that is, the project of Wuhan Huawei Optical Factory). The total investment of these two projects is as high as 10.985 billion yuan. And 1.8 billion yuan.
华为武汉芯片工厂进入产线调试，将实现芯片从设计到封测全自主
椰子小贝壳*暖暖春日 昨天 16:48 字数 183
数据显示，武汉华为光工厂项目地处武汉光谷的中心部位，总建筑面积高达20.89万平方米，建设的内容包括FAB生产厂房、CUB动力站、PMD软件工厂及其一系列的配套设施。该工厂是迄今为止华为在我国中部地区最大的研发基地，该工厂的重点主要放在光能力中心、智能终端研发中心等前沿科技等方面。
据相关的消息得知，此项目建成之后，将会成为华为国内的第一个芯片厂房并开始投入生产（主要职能就是为华为生产其自研的通信芯片及其模组），并将在很大程度上助力华为实现自己构建万物互联智能世界的愿景。将让华为真正的实现芯片从设计到制造、封装测试以及转化到消费市场的一套完整的产业链。
令人感到欣慰的是，该工厂将会由我国一家总部设在上海的研发公司直接代表华为来进行管理，并且也不会使用任何来自美国的技术！按照相关的计划，该工厂将会在2021年的年底开始生产45nm制程的芯片组，并且将会采用28 nm的光刻技术来完成。发展达到预期的话，还将在2022年实现20nm以下的工艺，制造专门服务于华为旗下电信部门的真正的国产芯片。
华为作为全球通信设备市场的佼佼者，其在创立之初就已经将眼光放在，布局光通信领域核心器件的光芯片上。从2012华为收购来自英国的CIP光子集成公司，再到2013年华为收购比利时硅光技术开发商Caliopa公司。均可以看出华为对于进入了光通信芯片市场的长远布局。到现在为止，华为对光通信芯片等方面的投入已经有六年之久，并且到现在已经实现了部分产品的自主研发和生产。特别是在光芯片(包含25G EML)、调制器、硅光(SiP)、DSP等许多领域都已经达到了自产用的技术能力。除此之外，华为也掌握了当前全球最为先进的800G光芯片的相关技术。
随着美国对我国科技企业不断加大“打压”力度，我国的科技企业都在奋力前进。尤其是华为的近期行动更值得让人敬畏，按照之前华为公布的募集说明书上的消息得知。在2019年的6月底之前，华为对外公布的在建工程就高达5项，其中就包含贵安的华为云数据中心项目、华为岗头人才公寓项目、华为的苏州研发项目以及华为的松山湖终端项目二期和松山湖华为培训学院等，计划在建的项目为：上海青浦研发、武汉海思工厂项目（也就是武汉华为光工厂的项目），这两个项目的总投资分别高达109.85亿元和18亿元。
« Last Edit: Today at 06:00:32 AM by xyz »
- Status