Chinese semiconductor industry

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vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
It's not good or bad so much as the policy is based on obviously flawed supposition. Unlike military goods like the J-20 which has wriggle room on numbers due of PLAAF's opacity the number of Huawei phones and laptops can very easily be tracked. It will not take long before everyone knows that the policy is based on a lie.
I see it as an excuse not to implement more sanctions. Biden wants to meet with Xi Dada bad
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
You would need to build an SSMB demo facility, and if they got that to work, then make a production facility.
Even if the funding came together reaching production would be many years away.
I think China is investing in many avenues towards EUV. It remains to be seen what will be funded in an actual working prototype.
 

pau

Just Hatched
Registered Member
He usually goes quite a bit more in depth than wiki-level, but of course not to the detail that this forum goes into. But I still find him not mentioning the only FEL/synchrotron lithography project that's currently undergoing construction right now in China to be weird, it's not like there's any other countries seriously working on this concept right now. And there's the massive buzz about China's semiconductor industry over the last few weeks because of Huawei.

I almost feel like he left the SSMB EUV project out of the video on purpose.
 

measuredingabens

Junior Member
Registered Member
You would need to build an SSMB demo facility, and if they got that to work, then make a production facility.
Even if the funding came together reaching production would be many years away.
I think China is investing in many avenues towards EUV. It remains to be seen what will be funded in an actual working prototype.
If they could start testing an EUVL prototype using the SSRF, then that has the possibility of speeding up the timeline considerably. At least if the lessons can then be transferred to the SSMB facility itself.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
You would need to build an SSMB demo facility, and if they got that to work, then make a production facility.
Even if the funding came together reaching production would be many years away.
I think China is investing in many avenues towards EUV. It remains to be seen what will be funded in an actual working prototype.

It's already known that LPP EUV is being pursued as well as SSMB EUV, with the former likely to emerge into practical use quite a bit earlier than the latter.

But that is exactly why the news reporting about SSMB has been somewhat stupid and going into the typical clickbait headlines that makes it seem like SSMB is going to emerge in the near future in a practical form for EUV lithography, or that they are pursuing SSMB "instead of" more conventional LPP EUV.
 

BlackWindMnt

Captain
Registered Member

Interesting video, but I wonder why he didn't mention Tsinghua's SSMB EUV project, since it's basically the only serious FEL/synchrotron EUV light source being worked on right now. Does he really not know about the project?

Should be interesting how both of these designs will develop. Also this video has a weird vibe to it as if its a way to make sure that if China succeeds with SSMB EUV they can say China stole it from the west...;)

Joking aside...
It does feel like China is on the right path, if others are also coming to the conclusion that shooting lasers to hit a tin drop isn't the way to scale down to the sub 1~3nm.
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
If they could start testing an EUVL prototype using the SSRF, then that has the possibility of speeding up the timeline considerably. At least if the lessons can then be transferred to the SSMB facility itself.
Using SSRF and also IHEP in Beijing, they had develop the optics, mask, photoresist and other related materials needed and validated for an EUVL And when the necessary power source are available, the Chinese EUVL will be production ready at the get go. We all had an inkling that we may see a prototype using LPP next year and SSMB in 2025.

Should be interesting how both of these designs will develop. Also this video has a weird vibe to it as if its a way to make sure that if China succeeds with SSMB EUV they can say China stole it from the west...;)

Joking aside...
It does feel like China is on the right path, if others are also coming to the conclusion that shooting lasers to hit a tin drop isn't the way to scale down to the sub 1~3nm.
With all due respect for the content YT creator, most of his information came from this forum. He may denied it BUT at least give respect where Respect is due.
 

coolgod

Colonel
Registered Member
It's already known that LPP EUV is being pursued as well as SSMB EUV, with the former likely to emerge into practical use quite a bit earlier than the latter.

But that is exactly why the news reporting about SSMB has been somewhat stupid and going into the typical clickbait headlines that makes it seem like SSMB is going to emerge in the near future in a practical form for EUV lithography, or that they are pursuing SSMB "instead of" more conventional LPP EUV.
Is China hyping up SSMB really stupid? Mislead your opponents about your experimental physics projects while you secretly develop LPP-EUV machines. Definitely not the first time China uses strategic misdirection on its secret R&D projects.
 

ansy1968

Brigadier
Registered Member
Is China hyping up SSMB really stupid? Mislead your opponents about your experimental physics projects while you secretly develop LPP-EUV machines. Definitely not the first time China uses strategic misdirection on its secret R&D projects.
Same thinking here bro BUT this time both are real, I'm expecting an official unveiling of an EUVL LPP in October 1 2024, the 75th anniversary of PROC, a month before the US presidential election, a parting gift to Brandon and a welcoming one for Trump. ;)
 
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