Chinese semiconductor industry

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FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
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For those of you that doubt my expertise, you are welcome to ask me about semiconductor fab technology.
I’m not insisting that my views are right that why I’m here to cross check/reference views here. But, may I remind you that if your source are from l media/articles then you have to consider how accurate these information are or if authors of these articles know what they are talking about.
You are free to believe what you read just like i am leaning to believe my contacts. If I learn something that is different from my view, i will use it to help guide me on what I need to go verify. That’s what I plan to do. I will not attack your views like some of you are doing to me. This is just how I roll.

We can judge for ourselves, thanks. Let me just remind you that experts know experts, and can always find out who is bullshit and who isn't eventually.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
I am just as skeptical.

In the news yesterday, Hikvision is buying a second hand ASML's AT:850C system (248nm KrF laser), because no domestic substitute is available:
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Since early last year I was reading on this forum that a domestic DUV immersion system capable of 28nm is just around the corner (I think it was supposed to already ship by now?), but here we have a Chinese company buying 20 year old technology initially used for 110nm production and later below that. Yet, we are to believe that EUV is just 3 years away?

Refurbished systems are typically bought for cost, not for performance. For performance you need not only the actual equipment but installation and application engineers to figure out the best way to use your equipment - which is best done for new equipment.

Canon sells brand new KrF front end systems:

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Here's SMEE KrF front end system:

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huemens

Junior Member
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As some of you were discussing whether SMIC would go for western equipment for their new fabs, here is a fresh letter from Marco Rubio to Gina Raimondo, requesting for more sanctions against SMIC, in the light of recent record breaking revenue growth from SMIC.

Rubio, McCaul Demand Tougher Protections Against Chinese Semiconductor Maker SMIC, Warn of Possible Beijing-Moscow Coordination​


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MAR 17 2022​

Washington, D.C. — U.S. Senator Marco Rubio (R-FL) and U.S. Representative Michael McCaul (R-TX) sent a letter to U.S. Department of Commerce Secretary Gina Raimondo urging the Department to strengthen Entity List rules for China’s Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corporation (SMIC) and expressing concern that Beijing may divert technology to Moscow to evade U.S. sanctions. Their letter follows requests in
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“We have written to the Commerce Department twice to express these concerns, imploring the department to take all steps necessary to strengthen American economic security,” the lawmakers wrote. “Since our last communication on the topic in March 2021, SMIC has posted record earnings, announcing soaring profits and sales up 39 percent during calendar year 2021. It was the company’s strongest growth in annual revenue since 2010. But, as of December 2021, reporting suggests that the Biden Administration had not yet resolved whether to block additional sales of American technology to SMIC and instead was mulling working with partners and allies in reaching such a decision. We request an update on the state of these discussions if they are indeed occurring, especially in light of SMIC’s record profits, by March 25, 2022.
 

FriedButter

Colonel
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I am just as skeptical.

In the news yesterday, Hikvision is buying a second hand ASML's AT:850C system (248nm KrF laser), because no domestic substitute is available:
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Since early last year I was reading on this forum that a domestic DUV immersion system capable of 28nm is just around the corner (I think it was supposed to already ship by now?), but here we have a Chinese company buying 20 year old technology initially used for 110nm production and later below that. Yet, we are to believe that EUV is just 3 years away?
I do remember that in the past pages that SMEE was said to be ramping up production in 2022 and a bit older post saying it in mid 2022. You can’t expect there to be dozens of system ready when they just started producing them for the first time.
 

tokenanalyst

Brigadier
Registered Member
As some of you were discussing whether SMIC would go for western equipment for their new fabs, here is a fresh letter from Marco Rubio to Gina Raimondo, requesting for more sanctions against SMIC, in the light of recent record breaking revenue growth from SMIC.

Rubio, McCaul Demand Tougher Protections Against Chinese Semiconductor Maker SMIC, Warn of Possible Beijing-Moscow Coordination​


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MAR 17 2022​

YMTC is also in the hit list of this people.
Like I said if Chinese semiconductor fab companies are not working 24/7 with Chinese semiconductor equipment, sub-systems and material providers, I think they are committing suicide.

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FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
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YMTC is also in the hit list of this people.
Like I said if Chinese semiconductor fab companies are not working 24/7 with Chinese semiconductor equipment, sub-systems and material providers, I think they are committing suicide.

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YMTC is actually the most localized of all as they're not listed and they recently did a supply chain and IP audit to ensure no foreign interference is possible.

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Tam

Brigadier
Registered Member
Anybody knows what best chips resolution CETC could produce? 32nm or 28nm ?

28nm. Much of the Chinese military chip production appears to be 40nm and higher. Always remember that the smaller the nm is, the more susceptible the chip is to EM interference, EMP, cosmic rays in the higher atmosphere, and so on, so there is a limit to how far any military will accept smaller and smaller nm. This is why going to another chip making technology like graphene or going to 3D stacking, might be a more attractive idea.

Remember this picture? Note that "20" on the third item should stand for J-20, while the others are for J-16 and J-10B. It also describes the modules used for the "-20" radar uses 3D MCM. The infographic describes three generations of AESA radars, starting with the J-10B at Gen 1.5. The four digits represent the number of elements so the J-10B is 12XX, the J-16 at 1760, and the J-20 at 1856.


XTIBKSQIBFHG25SELP4GFN5754-1024x1019 (1).jpg
 
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