Chinese purchase of Su-35

SampanViking

The Capitalist
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
That suggestion does make sense, but the fact that Xi left Russia without any official announcement of a deal makes a politically motivated buy seem much less likely.

New Chinese President on his first official visit to Russia, there is no better time for any politically motivated deals to be signed and announced in front of the cameras. If ever there was a good chance a Su35 deal might have been signed, it was during Pres Xi's visit. The fact that the deal didn't happen then pretty much speaks volumes about the chances of it ever happening.

Xi and Putin meet again shortly in South Africa for BRICS. This would be an ideal venue to announce formally such a deal.
I wonder if the deal was agreed but not actually signed and that the Russian side are a bit peeved at China jumping the gun a little?
 

Speeder

Junior Member
I think it could be for a very simple reason that each side of the argument could agree upon:

1. China doesn't mind, at all, to get hold on several Su-35 as the only 3rd party overall tech reference in the world it can get, for instance. It is worth a lot from this point of view.

2. Russia defence sector, however, wants to sell much more to get $, but only deliver a lot later due to its limitation of production lines.

There you go, of course there ahave been constant talks btw the two ,behind the door, and big mouth Russia media & so-called "expers" get in to bs whatever in order to test the bottom line and resolve of the other side of the negotiation.

Up to now, NOTHING is concret, I say.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Xi and Putin meet again shortly in South Africa for BRICS. This would be an ideal venue to announce formally such a deal.
I wonder if the deal was agreed but not actually signed and that the Russian side are a bit peeved at China jumping the gun a little?

What does a bilateral arms agreement has to do with anyone else that it needs an international audience for the announcement? If China were to buy Su35s for political considerations, those considerations would only extend to Russia. Plus, China has also consistently emphasised its peaceful rise doctrine, so announcing major arms deals during a BRICS meeting in Africa just seems to clash with that massage on all sorts of levels.

In all previous arms deals, it has always been the Russians jumping the gun and reporting deals still under negotiation as signed, so I am struggling to see how there would suddenly been such a massive role reversal, especially since it has been the Russians making all the noise about Su35s up until now.

I also cannot see what Russia would have to be 'peeved' about even if everything was as you said and China announced first. They have been desperate for someone to buy the Su35 for years, and afaik, the word couldn't get out quick enough for them if a deal has been done.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
After A Decade Long Wait, China And Russia Ink 'Super Jet' Military Deal
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Kenneth Rapoza, Contributor
Covering Brazil, Russia, India & China.

A recent official visit to Moscow brought back some new souvenirs for the Chinese military.

How about a reported 24 Sukhoi SU-35 fighter jets, and four submarines from Russia.

China‘s new president Xi Jinping was in Russia this week to meet with his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin. Both sides agreed to two arms-sale contracts in which China will buy Russian Sukhoi made fighter jets, Xinhua and Agence France Press reported on Monday.China has been itching to buy the planes since the 1990s and has been in hot pursuit since last March.

Russia’s Interfax confirmed the existence and date of that agreement back in February, but didn’t speculate on sales numbers. This month, official talks trimmed the order down to 24 planes from an initial discussion of 48 Sukhoi Super Flankers. The Russians are said to have more confidence that China can’t copy their engines, and are also said to need the SU-35 orders because Russia’s Defense Department is ordering follow-on buys of new upgraded Sukhoi SU-35s instead.

The deals raised concern among some regional defense players — namely India. China Central Television reported on Sunday that the purchase deals were signed before President Xi Jinping’s ever stepped foot into Russia. The military deal marks the first time in a decade that China had bought large military technological equipment from Russia, according to official television.

Meanwhile, the four Lada-class diesel-electric submarines will be jointly designed and built by both countries, with two of them to be built in Russia and the other two in China.

“The Su-35 fighters can effectively reduce pressure on China’s air defense before Chinese-made stealth fighters come online,” Li Hong, secretary-general of the China Arms Control and Disarmament Association, said in a Xinhua newswire story. Li said the recent purchases and joint building plan serve as an indicator of the evolution of the overall China-Russian strategic partnership.

“It is the natural, well-deserved fruit of bilateral defense cooperation, and both sides have made it clear that the bilateral strategic partnership is not targeting anyone,” Li said.

The Sukhoi SU-35 is a single seat super maneuverable, acrobatic fighter plane. Russia is the only Air Force to fly the SU-35. At altitude, its top speed is Mach 2.25 compared to Mach 2 for the U.S. F-16 Fighting Falcon, another multirole fighter aircraft made by General Dynamics and Lockheed Martin. The SU-35 is designed by Sukhoi and built together with Komsomolsk Aircraft Production Association, aka KnAPPO, Russia’s largest aircraft maker. Both are part of United Aircraft Corporation.
Forbes.com... Meh.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Forbes.com... Meh.

What a joke of an article. The only two things clear from it is this Rapoza's bias against China, to the point of making sh!t up (where did he pull the 'with a warning from Russia' BS about copying from in the caption?) and how clueless he is about what he is talking about. And it is sourced from the same chat show that kick this all of, only now it has been 'upgraded' into a 'news wire' story. :rolleyes:

Seriously, this all just reinforces my longstanding point that journalisms desperately needs a minimum competence standard to weed out all the useless jabbering idiots.
 

TyroneG

Banned Idiot
What's the big deal about the purchase if it's true?

Those in extreme denial are just as bad as those russians who like to spread rumors.
 
Last edited:

SampanViking

The Capitalist
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
What does a bilateral arms agreement has to do with anyone else that it needs an international audience for the announcement? If China were to buy Su35s for political considerations, those considerations would only extend to Russia. Plus, China has also consistently emphasised its peaceful rise doctrine, so announcing major arms deals during a BRICS meeting in Africa just seems to clash with that massage on all sorts of levels.

In all previous arms deals, it has always been the Russians jumping the gun and reporting deals still under negotiation as signed, so I am struggling to see how there would suddenly been such a massive role reversal, especially since it has been the Russians making all the noise about Su35s up until now.

I also cannot see what Russia would have to be 'peeved' about even if everything was as you said and China announced first. They have been desperate for someone to buy the Su35 for years, and afaik, the word couldn't get out quick enough for them if a deal has been done.

I think the key word I keep reading is signed, rather than agreed.
My reading is that the deal was brokered in advance and the original hope would have been to have it signed and sealed while Xi was in Moscow. Clearly some details were still unresolved and so no doubt these are being/have been thrashed out in the back room. A Disappointment but no big deal as both leaders are due to meet shortly afterwards at BRICS where the deal can be signed on the sidelines and then announced.

It is annoying when somebody claims a deal is complete when in fact it is still being negotiated as it can look like a tactic to bulldoze an agreement before the other side is ready with final agreement. Its regarded as poor form and rather rubs people up the wrong way. That being said, everybody seems to do it, especially at the point where the terms are stuck in a position that the leaker likes.

Then again I can also see why a major defence deal could be regarded as being just the ticket to add to the general tally of expected announcements being touted as likely to emerge from the summit. These include incidently a major announcement regarding the inauguration of the BRICS Bank; widely anticipated to be based in Shanghai, trading principally in the Yuan and presenting as an alternative to IMF and World Bank, a BRICS rating agency to provide an alternative to Moody's and S&P etc.

A defence contract which included a vote of confidence from China for systems that Russia would love to sell into the other club members, is not such a strange notion.

BRICS summit details only provided for illustrative purposes, so please lets not wander off topic to discuss them. If you wish to do so, open a thread in the Club Room.
 

Curious George

New Member
What's the big deal about the purchase if it's true?

Exactly. If it turns out to be true, look at it this way: China is spending less than 3 Billion dollars to bind Russia closer to itself econimically and geopolitacally (defense cooperation) and it gets 24 Su35s and 4 Submarines in return. The US on the other hand spends Billions in "aid" to Egypt, Afghanistan, Israel etc to try to bind those countries closer to itself and doesn't really get anything back in terms of military hardware.
 
Top