Chinese Economics Thread

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
kind of a response to you, but also some random thoughts.

While I do think China can have a lot of control over who/how many to let in, making a decision on who/how many is much harder. Running a country means dealing with many factors with complex interactions with each other, and it's hard to predict the exact outcomes. I think we will need to rely a bit on faith and value judgment.
Faith and value judgement is where it's all at when we can't use black and white rules to separate people since these rules would be too discriminatory on paper.
Both Elon Musk and Jensen Huang's parents are immigrants would have fit only the k-visa but not the R-visa. But they created companies that gave the US an enduring edge over China. The US let in a lot of people to have these two to change the world.
Yeah but America is a relatively talentless society compared to China. If America didn't do this, it'd be an idiot non-competitive country. China, on the other hand, is teeming with incredible talent; our only weakness is the low starting point. We are at a point where we overcome this with selective talent recruitment to attack bottlenecks. We do not need mass talent flow because is redundant with what we already have. In the end, Elon Musk and Jensen Huang are both getting thier lunches eaten by Chinese companies.
From our side, can a Chinese person do the work that Katherine (Katherine's journey to the east, BS from the US, and MS from China) was employed for? Certainly! But I think she has made and continues to make tremendous contributions to China (likely more than anyone on this forum!).
Do what work? Show off rural China to Westerners? Other than that, she's a PhD in environmental science and she married a Chinese dude. We have millions of excess males so she's cool in complementing China's needs I guess. Special case approval for her!
I can think of two reasons immigrants tend to be more successful, given the same degree and even GPA. 1) Self-selection on risk-taking and 2) being bi-cultural from immigration.
They're not in China unless they're either bringing success from their own countries or they're coat-tailing white worship. People who come to China are adventurous, but Chinese people are still smarter.
I think we can all agree that a degree is not a good predictor of how much a k-visa candidate will benefit China. It's also hard to measure some of the benefits of having foreign workers on the Chinese society in general. I think using rigid measures of GDP and birth rate in the past was a lesson that we shouldn't repeat. The only suggestion I can come up with here is using an interview process that doesn't give an immediate answer and having multiple interviewers to reduce bias (like a job interview).

A crossing the river by feeling the stone approach is probably the right approach again on this issue. Start small and expand over time as we see fit. It will take a while for all the parties (visa applicants, the Gov, employers, and the Chinese people) to iron it out.
M'kay
 

slime888

New Member
Registered Member
I’m sorry but it's obvious what's happening here: the CCP is getting high off their own supply and they want to play "world leader" and virtue signal to foreigners. It's clear as plain day if you just read that interview where they talk about wanting to be better than the xenophobic West.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
I’m sorry but it's obvious what's happening here: the CCP is getting high off their own supply and they want to play "world leader" and virtue signal to foreigners. It's clear as plain day if you just read that interview where they talk about wanting to be better than the xenophobic West.
We just did this stupid shit with 2 other guys yesterday, one of whom is now banned. Why don't you reread the last 8-10 pages and continue the argument if you have anything to add rather than starting the same argument again at the exact same baseline we already took off from 2 times already?
 

GiantPanda

Junior Member
Registered Member
In my view, the K visa remains a rather foolish policy, at least as it currently appears—hasty and vague. I will follow up to determine exactly which universities and research institutions qualify for K visas.

Absolutely not. This thing was thought through over the years and is targeted at hard-core STEM, especially since the trade war and the push towards high tech manufacturing.

People (including some in China) are thinking this is H1B idiocy because of the timing. No it is not.

No code monkey/salary arbitrage like what plagued the US system. In fact, the numbers will still be limited (though larger than Thousand Talents) because the government will pick and choose from the applicants -- not companies gaming the systems.

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Before this revision, China’s
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recognized 12 categories of ordinary visas, covering purposes like
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. The amendment makes two main changes:


  1. A New Visa Category — Article 6 now includes: “(6) K visa: issued to foreign young science and technology talent entering China.”
  2. Application Requirements — Article 7 now specifies: “Applicants for a K visa must meet the conditions and requirements for foreign young science and technology talent stipulated by the relevant Chinese authorities and submit corresponding supporting documents.”
The definition of “young science and technology talent” is quite specific:
  • Graduates in STEM (science, technology, engineering, mathematics) fields from recognized universities or research institutions worldwide, holding at least a bachelor’s degree; or
  • Young professionals engaged in relevant education or research work at such institutions.

How the K visa differs from existing options

Compared with existing visa types for work or research,
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:


  • More flexibility: No requirement for a Chinese employer or inviter at the application stage.
  • Convenience: Potentially more generous terms for entry frequency, validity period, and duration of stay.
  • Breadth of permitted activities: Holders can engage in education, research, cultural exchange, entrepreneurship, and business.
In practice, this makes it more appealing to fresh graduates, independent researchers, and entrepreneurs who might not yet have formal job offers in China but want to explore opportunities.

Implications for China’s talent landscape

Boosting Early-Career Talent Flow

Most immigration systems favor experienced professionals with long CVs. The K visa takes a different angle, aiming at youth — those in the formative stages of their careers. That means China is not just importing skills, but also building long-term relationships that may yield decades of collaboration.
 

tamsen_ikard

Senior Member
Registered Member
K-Visa will be gone sooner than you think, it will end the same way as covid lockdowns, through protests, lockdowns magically disappeared in China to day as usual.
There isn't enough interest in foreigners to learn Chinese that they will suddenly start pouring in. This Visa scheme is a much more long term. The expectation is that, slowly there will be more interest in learning Chinese and using K-Visa. Even if there is "protest", it will be much more low key and long term. I expect opposition to take decades.
 

PandaAI

Junior Member
Registered Member
Is it true that Wang Huiyao, chair of the Center for China and Globalisation (CCG) think tank which has long promoted China to change immigration policies is behind the K visa? Apparently he was also the one that pushed for the 2020 Foreign Permanent Resident program. All the establishment think tanks in the US loves Wang Huiyao. Reading some of his articles, he advocates for a US-like immigration policy for China. Looks like K Visa will be just the start. He seems to have quite the influence on decision makers in Beijing too considering he is an advisor to the Chinese premier.
 
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PiSigma

"the engineer"
Why should Chinese people have to compete for jobs with foreigners in China?
I don't think you realize how much competition there is in China and how competitive chinese people are. It literally starts at age 2 for pre school. China is a big pressure cooker and 99.9% of foreigners won't be able to take it.

There is no need to worry about mass immigration. Who ever gets the K visa first have to be pass the interviews, get a job, learn Chinese , and not commit suicide/run home under the chinese high pressure 996 culture. I will bet serious money that if 50% of people retain their k visa even.
 
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