It is definitely NOT love to China. You are absolutely correct about that. It is tit for tat against USA.
China won Turkey's missile defense competition
- Thread starter Hendrik_2000
- Start date
It is definitely NOT love to China. You are absolutely correct about that. It is tit for tat against USA.
U.S. concerned about Turkey's choice of Chinese missile system
(Reuters) - The United States said on Saturday it had expressed serious concerns to Turkey over its decision to co-produce a long-range air and missile defense system with a Chinese firm under U.S. sanctions.
Turkey, a member of the NATO military alliance, announced this week that it had chosen the FD-2000 missile defense system from China Precision Machinery Import and Export Corp, or CPMIEC, over rival systems from Russian, U.S. and European firms.
CPMIEC is under U.S. sanctions for violations of the Iran, North Korea and Syria Nonproliferation Act.
"We have conveyed our serious concerns about the Turkish government's contract discussions with a U.S.-sanctioned company for a missile defense system that will not be inter-operable with NATO systems or collective defense capabilities," a State Department spokeswoman said.
"Our discussions on this issue will continue."
Some Western defense analysts have said they were surprised by Turkey's decision, having expected the contract to go to Raytheon Co, a U.S. company that builds the Patriot missile, or the Franco/Italian Eurosam SAMP/T.
The United States, Germany and the Netherlands each sent two Patriot batteries and up to 400 soldiers to operate them to southeastern Turkey early this year after Ankara asked NATO for help with air defenses against possible missile attack from Syria.
Turkey has long been the United States' closest ally in the Middle Eastern region, bordering on the Soviet Union during the Cold War. The U.S. military exercised great influence over a Turkish military that had a strong hand in Turkey's politics.
Under Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan, elected in 2002, the role of the Turkish military in politics has been curbed. Political and military relations between Ankara and Washington, while still close, play a less central role and that could be reflected in procurement policy.
(Reuters) - The United States said on Saturday it had expressed serious concerns to Turkey over its decision to co-produce a long-range air and missile defense system with a Chinese firm under U.S. sanctions.
Turkey, a member of the NATO military alliance, announced this week that it had chosen the FD-2000 missile defense system from China Precision Machinery Import and Export Corp, or CPMIEC, over rival systems from Russian, U.S. and European firms.
CPMIEC is under U.S. sanctions for violations of the Iran, North Korea and Syria Nonproliferation Act.
"We have conveyed our serious concerns about the Turkish government's contract discussions with a U.S.-sanctioned company for a missile defense system that will not be inter-operable with NATO systems or collective defense capabilities," a State Department spokeswoman said.
"Our discussions on this issue will continue."
Some Western defense analysts have said they were surprised by Turkey's decision, having expected the contract to go to Raytheon Co, a U.S. company that builds the Patriot missile, or the Franco/Italian Eurosam SAMP/T.
The United States, Germany and the Netherlands each sent two Patriot batteries and up to 400 soldiers to operate them to southeastern Turkey early this year after Ankara asked NATO for help with air defenses against possible missile attack from Syria.
Turkey has long been the United States' closest ally in the Middle Eastern region, bordering on the Soviet Union during the Cold War. The U.S. military exercised great influence over a Turkish military that had a strong hand in Turkey's politics.
Under Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan, elected in 2002, the role of the Turkish military in politics has been curbed. Political and military relations between Ankara and Washington, while still close, play a less central role and that could be reflected in procurement policy.
I would assume that it is the same body, but possibly with downgraded capabilities.
Also does anyone knows how diferente Hq-9 is from S-300, seeing that it is similar to the russian system, (at least superficially) ?
broadsword
Brigadier
Assuming the HQ-9 incorporates stolen guidance technology from Patriot, shouldn't the Patriot have performed similarly or better than the HQ-9?
The body of the shown model of fd2000 on zhuhai is different from the body of hq9 and hhq9 (which have the same body) shown in various images of PLA/N exercises.
While the difference isn't huge, it's noticable. FD2000 has a straight, cylindrical body all the way to the radome. HQ9 missile, like the s300 missiles, have a slight conical taper towards the radome.
Again, question is how accurate is fd2000 model? Usually that'd be the first thing i'd dismiss, as models are usually quite rough, but this one shown on zhuhai is otherwise very well made and has tons of fine detail.
Comparing s300 missiles with hq9 missiles, missile's outward appearance is nearly identical. length to width ratio is basically the same, fins are almost the same shape-wise, etc.
some small differences can be observed. hq9 has slightly smaller rear fins, enough so that it gives the appearance that body of the missile protrudes furhter aft of them, compared to s300 missile.
Also, it appears that the thrust control vanes on hq9 protrude more aft, out of the missile's body, than on s300.
radome on hg9 seems to be slightly more curved than one on s300 missile.
All those differences can be observed here: (hq9 is on the left)
What the image doesn't tell us is overall size, as the two missiles aren't fully to scale because they can't be fully to scale. My gut feeling is that s300 missile is slightly larger in every regard, so in fact it could be longer and wider than hq9 missile. But the difference should be pretty small. Maybe something like a few tens of centimetres, length wise, a few cm width wise?
Also, hq9 may have slightly less of a taper toward the radome, compared to s300 missile. But the taper is still certainly there, unlike on the fd2000 model which appears completely straight, like the patriot's missile.
Disregarding the missiles, we do know that fd-2000 is marketed as having active radar guidance. Also, is it extremely likely hhq9 (on 052c/d) uses active radar guidance. Thus it is also perhaps likely that hq9 family as a whole uses active radar guidance. If that is so, then it is also likely (but there's no way to confirm that) that hq9 radar is not an x band radar like guidance radar for s300 is, but likely a C band radar (like patriot) or theoretically even an S band radar. (since it is very likely 052c/d uses S band arrays)
Don't ask about range as that is something thhere hasn't been any official mention anywhere. At least not to my knowledge.
While the difference isn't huge, it's noticable. FD2000 has a straight, cylindrical body all the way to the radome. HQ9 missile, like the s300 missiles, have a slight conical taper towards the radome.
Again, question is how accurate is fd2000 model? Usually that'd be the first thing i'd dismiss, as models are usually quite rough, but this one shown on zhuhai is otherwise very well made and has tons of fine detail.
Comparing s300 missiles with hq9 missiles, missile's outward appearance is nearly identical. length to width ratio is basically the same, fins are almost the same shape-wise, etc.
some small differences can be observed. hq9 has slightly smaller rear fins, enough so that it gives the appearance that body of the missile protrudes furhter aft of them, compared to s300 missile.
Also, it appears that the thrust control vanes on hq9 protrude more aft, out of the missile's body, than on s300.
radome on hg9 seems to be slightly more curved than one on s300 missile.
All those differences can be observed here: (hq9 is on the left)
What the image doesn't tell us is overall size, as the two missiles aren't fully to scale because they can't be fully to scale. My gut feeling is that s300 missile is slightly larger in every regard, so in fact it could be longer and wider than hq9 missile. But the difference should be pretty small. Maybe something like a few tens of centimetres, length wise, a few cm width wise?
Also, hq9 may have slightly less of a taper toward the radome, compared to s300 missile. But the taper is still certainly there, unlike on the fd2000 model which appears completely straight, like the patriot's missile.
Disregarding the missiles, we do know that fd-2000 is marketed as having active radar guidance. Also, is it extremely likely hhq9 (on 052c/d) uses active radar guidance. Thus it is also perhaps likely that hq9 family as a whole uses active radar guidance. If that is so, then it is also likely (but there's no way to confirm that) that hq9 radar is not an x band radar like guidance radar for s300 is, but likely a C band radar (like patriot) or theoretically even an S band radar. (since it is very likely 052c/d uses S band arrays)
Don't ask about range as that is something thhere hasn't been any official mention anywhere. At least not to my knowledge.
Re: U.S. concerned about Turkey's choice of Chinese missile system
well here we go again. this is the first shot fired at turkey
in the coming couple of weeks we should see the full onslaught against the Turkish govt and military from the state dept and the pentagon. the Turkish fort cannot hold, it will do as Israel did in the falcon awac's scenario. this contract will be aborted so let's watch the drama
well here we go again. this is the first shot fired at turkey
in the coming couple of weeks we should see the full onslaught against the Turkish govt and military from the state dept and the pentagon. the Turkish fort cannot hold, it will do as Israel did in the falcon awac's scenario. this contract will be aborted so let's watch the drama
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
Turkish military policy is to build everything themselves
Where this is not possible they go joint venture
And finally where joint venture is not possible they buy outright like F35 which is also facing pressure for cancellation
So China must have offered second opition which still fits Turkish needs
Where this is not possible they go joint venture
And finally where joint venture is not possible they buy outright like F35 which is also facing pressure for cancellation
So China must have offered second opition which still fits Turkish needs