China Flanker thread

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crobato

Colonel
VIP Professional
歼10+SU27+SU30+歼11+飞豹II……已经不下400架了~


可以排进前10名了吧??
【兵人】于2007-01-10


共军现有7个J11/Su27团 四个19架的Su30团和一个24架的Su30团 包子A大概有两个满编团 就是棍子的数量不知道
【羊肉烩面】2007-01-10

1S1T 2S6T 6S16T 7S19T 14S40T 19S55T 33S98T
【羊肉烩面】2007-01-10

14是最后一个换装的 131和8估计满编了 6S 7S估计可能性不大吧 毕竟不是重点方向 俺倒是觉得现在飞7E的14S42T很有希望
【羊肉烩面】2007

Got this in the WMF.

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Numbers represent division and regiments of J-11 and Su-27

1st Division 1st Regiment
2nd Division 6th Regiment
6th Division 16th Regiment
7th Division 19th Regiment
14th Division 40th Regiment
19th Division 55th Regiment
33th Division 98th Regiment
 

Totoro

Major
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So, 7 regiments times 24 planes in a regiment - that's some 168 planes, no? Too few if all the ubk models are included in the regiments, but if they're not, (though it's been said they are) then it shows j11 production has went along nicely past the reported 100-105 units.
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
VIP Professional
Re: Could be a J-11B with WS-10A engines

This may be I just said may be the J-11B with WS-10A engines. I dnt know but the engines at the back dnt seem to be the AL-31F. Take a careful look at the engine. If it's not that then delete the post.:confused:

Is this aircraft taking off or landing? If it's taking off why are its flaps down? They should be up. If it is landing>> why is it at Full afterburner. Stage 5 as we use to say in the USN. I summize that this picture is a J-11 landing with the engines PSed to appear to be in full afterburner.

Just my opinion.
 

Scratch

Captain
Re: Could be a J-11B with WS-10A engines

Is this aircraft taking off or landing? If it's taking off why are its flaps down? They should be up. If it is landing>> why is it at Full afterburner. Stage 5 as we use to say in the USN. I summize that this picture is a J-11 landing with the engines PSed to appear to be in full afterburner.

Just my opinion.

Well, I'm sure it's taking off. Now I'm really suprised. Do US aircraft take off from carriers with retracted flaps?? They should be down during take off and landing, since this happens at very low speeds were those fighter airfoils, wich are designed for high-speeds, give little lift. The flaps down increase the airfoil surface, thus giving greater lift.

Of course it also increases drag, could this be the reason why USN aircraft depart with flaps up? Though I can't really imagine they are doing it. Perhaps because they already have some feet of air under the wing when leaving the deck, while aircraft taking off from land have not.
 

bd popeye

The Last Jedi
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Well, I'm sure it's taking off. Now I'm really suprised. Do US aircraft take off from carriers with retracted flaps?? They should be down during take off and landing, since this happens at very low speeds were those fighter airfoils, wich are designed for high-speeds, give little lift. The flaps down increase the airfoil surface, thus giving greater lift.

You are correct..:( My bad...I goofed. and I should know better. I even looked it up to learn something I long forgot...

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Back to the picture. When I first looked at it the angle it was taking off just did not look righ. It looked more like a naval fighter rather than a air force craft. In the US generally navy fighters take off at such a steep angle.
 

Scratch

Captain
I think this is not an all so steep angle, the long tail of the Flankers make take off angles look rather steep, since they come close to the ground even at lower angels. That's an imperssion I got.
Furthermore, if my eyes don't cheat me, this aircraft carries no ordnance. So perhaps that sortie is just about AHC (aircraft handling characteristics). See what's possible. Or the pilot is just trying to have some fun.
 

crobato

Colonel
VIP Professional
So, 7 regiments times 24 planes in a regiment - that's some 168 planes, no? Too few if all the ubk models are included in the regiments, but if they're not, (though it's been said they are) then it shows j11 production has went along nicely past the reported 100-105 units.

That still includes 76 Su-27SKs and UBKs plus the J-11s. At least when these regs are formed, the older planes are still there (minus a few attritions of course).

Though I have to say, that some of the regs there appear to have as much as 32 aircraft. For example, when the regiment on the 33rd Div got their Su-27UBKs, they got all 28 of them, numbered from 49 to 76. Then they got four J-11s on top of that, all serialed to 80. Now some of the UBKs may have been parceled to other regiments, but in their place, they got more J-11s are replacements.

The 1st Regiment and the 19th Regiment both have UBKs that are numbered 32. One cannot say that the original is UBK no. 32 originally from the 6th Regiment 2nd Division, as two planes with the same unit no. to appear in both squads. For that matter, both units have UBKs that are numbered 28 to 32, and therefore cannot be originals from the 2nd Divison, since some of these UBKs are the new types that were parceled out from the 33rd. So the 32 is the regiment unit no. not the no. the Sukhoi factory gave in the early batches. That aligns to about 32 aircraft on these regiments.

In addition, the sighting of J-11 no. 30 with the 55th Regiment, 19th Division, also suggests the unit has 30+ aircraft.

So if you think about it, if all 7 regiments actually has 32 aircraft, that amounts to 224 planes, and that means at least 148 J-11s were made minus the original SK/UBKs.

Realistically, let's say 5 of the regiments have 32 aircraft, these ones from the 1st, 2nd, 7th, 19th and 33rd. Pls 2 regiments with 24 aircraft, you get 208. Less 76 you still get 132 J-11s. Eventually though, the other two regiments should be filling up also.

All this points out is that after that after the 105 kits, China continues to build J-11s that were kitless, though the components are now obtained seperately and not packaged with the kit. This is consistent with the report that China ordered engines seperately for J-11 construction, when previously, the engines should be packaged with the kits. I call the kitless J-11s the J-11As, and I believe they have a darker paint job like J-11 30 of the 19the 19th Division.

In a sense, I think the J-11As were testing the completely Chinese made airframes, as opposed to the airframes that were supplied from the Russian kits. I have a theory that these aircraft will also be upgraded to J-11B standards avionically minus engine, their replaced components be used as spares.
 

kickars

Junior Member
I can't quite understand J-11B. Can I say J-11B is a single-seater verson of Su-30MK2? Or is it just a simply upgraded J-11? But isn't Su30 a two-seater verson of upgraded Su-27(J-11)? Really confused now.
 
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Totoro

Major
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J11B is, or will be, fully domestic plane. That's why its being developed. It will probably start off not much more capable than su30, but it will be easier to upgrade it, unlike costly modernization russian planes would have to undergo. It is basically an investment into the future.
 

Chengdu J-10

Junior Member
J-11B a single seater upgraded from a J-11, license production of the Russia Su-27SK. The J-11B is either fully or mostly made from domestic Chinese parts enhancing the original J-11 basic license production of the Su-27SK to a more multi-role fighter through Chinese technology upgrades possibly designated as the J-11B. Most significant upgrades or domestic insertions that sets it apart from the basic J-11 would be replacing the Russia AL-31F turbofans to the Chinese WS-10A turbofans with increased thrust from 122.8kN to 129.4kN. And replacing the Russian NIIP N001 radar with Chinese Shedian-10 and finally the Russian R-77 AAM's with Chinese SD-10 AAM's. Now the original J-11 (Su-27) is a single seater and according to some articles so is the J-11B, and the Su-30MKK series are two seaters. If the single seater of the J-11B is true is basically and technological upgraded version of the the Su-27SK with near or full Chinese technology. Though the J-11B will have increased manuverability over the basic J-11, and can play more roles than the J-11 of being air superiority.

With the last post if their are any errors with the information feel free to correct or discuss. Though I do think that the J-11B will or has incorporated TVC turbofans engines.
 
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