Hence the theory that SAC is too busy making J-15s to make J-11s.
China Flanker Thread II
- Thread starter sumdud
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asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
if J10B and J11B Regiments are standing up each year, that is 1 each, then China needs to make atleast 75-100 WS10 engines per year, that is not a very high rate but come to think of it, its not a low rate either
SinoSoldier
Colonel
Isn't a squadron of 15-20 J-15, 10 J-15S already enough for an air wing? The J-15 production line shouldn't take up too much time and space even if it involves reconfiguring the entire factory.
kwaigonegin
Colonel
it all depends on what an 'air wing' means. I am quite sure each country defines it's 'wing'.. differently. In the USAF and USN an operational wing can consist anywhere from 30 -60 units or more depending on the type and mission status. Be it a air lift 'wing', a fighter 'wing' a carrier air 'wing' etc....Carrier Air Wings can consist of many different types which also includes rotary aircraft as well...
like I said it all depends. I do not know the organizational unit of the PLAAF/PLAN well enough to know how they segment their 'wings'. I'm sure some members here can fill us less educated in on them.
Schumacher
Senior Member
I wonder what kind of political bargaining. Something like this ?
China: How about helping me out to put some heat on Japan & US over the island thing ?
like fly your bombers around Japan or even better Guam ?
Russia: What's in it for me ? Buy some Su35 from me. Nobody wants it, it's making me look bad.
China: But like you said, nobody wants it. We have better stuffs like J16, 20, 21/31 etc.
Russia: I know, but can we at least pretend we're talking about a sell so I can tell my other clients,
'Hey look, China is interested !'. I think we can then sell to India at US$500milllion each.
China: Not a bad idea.
The point is that while they're making J-15s they might not have capacity to make J-11s. It's not just factory space and time. It's also the size of the labour force. If you want to expand production capacity you not only need to give time to build facilities and acquire machinery. You also need to give time to train new workers. Anyways, it's just a possible reason if they are indeed buying Su-35s. They could just as easily decide that they can expand capacity faster than Su-35s could be delivered, or else decide to forgo new J-11s for a year.
Equation
Lieutenant General
The number grows higher as they train new coming engineers and specialized factory workers on the engine production.
Not necessarily. The point isnt in increasing production rate as much as it can go but settling the needs of a customer, in this case plaaf and planaf, and devising the most cost efficient production plan and production rate. We're talking probably about 10 year long production plans, if not longer.
It is actually likely the j11b production reached its peak some time ago and it isnt cost efficient for the customer (plaaf) to demand SAC to raise it any further.
we had a first regiment operational back in 2008. And today, in 2013., we might be seeing another regiment standing up, if these recent images are true. That would be 6 regiments overall. And some 140-150 j11b/bs produced altogether. In some six years. Production rate seems to be hanging at little over 25 per year.
Similar thing can be said about j10. manufacturer can produce 100 planes a year, if customer pays him. Maybe it would take two-three years to get the added production going, but it would be doable. Trouble is, it would come at such an extra cost that no customer is ready to pay for that. Why get 1000 new J10 in 10 years? What to do with those planes currently in service which are just 10-15 years old? Customer requests are tailored so the new planes replace old ones when old ones are ready for retirement, not earlier than that.
It is actually likely the j11b production reached its peak some time ago and it isnt cost efficient for the customer (plaaf) to demand SAC to raise it any further.
we had a first regiment operational back in 2008. And today, in 2013., we might be seeing another regiment standing up, if these recent images are true. That would be 6 regiments overall. And some 140-150 j11b/bs produced altogether. In some six years. Production rate seems to be hanging at little over 25 per year.
Similar thing can be said about j10. manufacturer can produce 100 planes a year, if customer pays him. Maybe it would take two-three years to get the added production going, but it would be doable. Trouble is, it would come at such an extra cost that no customer is ready to pay for that. Why get 1000 new J10 in 10 years? What to do with those planes currently in service which are just 10-15 years old? Customer requests are tailored so the new planes replace old ones when old ones are ready for retirement, not earlier than that.
Well, that's the whole point of having the PLAN coming in as a second customer, assuming the PLAN is being treated as a second customer...unless you're saying SAC has already reached a point where diseconomies of scale have taken over.
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