Chengdu next gen combat aircraft (?J-36) thread

[Ringsword]

Some hobbyist already built RC model roughly based on J-36 design. It flew and maneuvered pretty well. Feel free to delete this if deemed inappropriate in this thread

And the CAC/SAC "real scale models flew"even better in China's world beating super advanced JF22 Mach 30 plus wid tunnel-as for me I want the full set of SAGAD,CACGAD and Xian H20 -TEMU/ALIEXPRESS!!after all is revealed-hopefully very soon-it'll look great in my library-

 

[peijunfei]

 

[kwaigonegin]

Some hobbyist already built RC model roughly based on J-36 design. It flew and maneuvered pretty well. Feel free to delete this if deemed inappropriate in this thread

I think it's a very cool rc plane. Very impressed by the builder. The closest to the real thing I supposed.
Big difference would be the nozzles and the wing tip vertical stabilizers for yaw.
The J36 has the split rudders as we know.

 

[siegecrossbow]

You can’t use RC planes to predict real kinematic since they by default have ridiculous thrust to weight ratios.

 

[MC530]

Imho here you see it has TVC clearly, since the nozzles are quite literally pointing at different directions.

It's just a question of how exactly it was achieved with so minimal movable surfaces.

There is no need for too intense movements and no need for large displacements. At the same time, the huge thrust of the three engines can also balance better torque with the help of TVC.
The impact of supersonic maneuvers and a huge body cannot allow the J36 to achieve F22-level subsonic maneuverability, but it can still be expected to have maneuvers above 6g, not participate in any dog fights, and have good nose directionality at supersonic speeds. Then don’t fight at subsonic speeds throughout the whole process (unless during an air show).

 

[00CuriousObserver]

A question: J-36's EW and radar/sensor capabilities have been widely discussed and emphasized. But wouldn't these make any plane very detectable and contradict its stealth capabilities?

 

[tphuang]

A question: J-36's EW and radar/sensor capabilities have been widely discussed and emphasized. But wouldn't these make any plane very detectable and contradict its stealth capabilities?

Well, that's where LPI mode comes in. although I'm not a fan of the term. The idea is that you emit waves at different frequency and wave forms so that it's harder to pick up on. How do you know which wave comes from which aircraft and how far it was emitted from?

When it comes to MMIC, it doesn't amplify every wave. It uses filters to decide which waves to process before passing to Low Noise amplifier to get the full signal. It's not clear to me just how RWR filters these things, but at least that's how main radar process the returning wave.

Also, your RF emitter is not always going to be on. Especially when you are working with a bunch of UCAVs, you can have the controlling aircraft act as just getting raw data from all the UCAVs and then do sensor fusion to compose the entire picture.

There is also the question of what emitters can do to confuse defense so they think there are objects when they are not there. That's something EW can really mess up defense in. Although this is pretty complicated stuff. Since I don't work in the industry, I won't be really to explain it well here.

 

[styx]

It's fun listening to Americans trying to map next gen designs into their last gen understanding.
- Every design is for sniping tankers because they can't imagine their fighters getting shot down
- J-36 is once again for projecting power to 2IC because they can't imagine losing those islands
- J-36 being mature must mean it's not as advanced because they can't imagine US is really that far behind.
- US having nothing to show for must be because US have higher requirements because they can't imagine US can't meet Chinese requirements
- China must struggle to fund all those projects because they can't imagine America is infact a far smaller economy than China.
- GCAP is a thing because they live under the delusion that UK and Japan are solvent and remotely relevant.

Some people think J-36/J-50 is great for NGAD, I think it's actually the worst thing that could happen to it. Without J-36 they could redefine NGAD to be something more within America's limited capabilities, but with J-36, J-50 and other systems, and with American refusal to acknowledge their limitations, they'll get trapped into perpetually unhappy with whatever they come up with, either because it's beyond their abilities, or its too low-end to fit their imperial delusions, with end result being they end up with nothing.

I think Americans struggle to grasp the "scale" of China. The Chinese can easily allocate double or triple the number of engineers or specialists that America can afford to dedicate to a program like NGAD. Assuming these are top-tier engineers (and even the Americans admit this), there’s really no chance that America can keep up. China has infinitely more human resources. They might take comfort in the fact that China’s demographic pyramid is quite unfavorable and that "they can rely" on Indians and Mexicans to manage their most secret defense programs, but for the next 20 years, things will only get worse for American defense in "containing" China—and I think they know it.

 

[styx]

Don’t you think the third engine could be very useful in providing additional thrust to "kinematically outmaneuver" incoming missiles?

 

[donnnage99]

Well, that's where LPI mode comes in. although I'm not a fan of the term. The idea is that you emit waves at different frequency and wave forms so that it's harder to pick up on. How do you know which wave comes from which aircraft and how far it was emitted from?

I believe what you're referring to is the anti jamming of frequency hopping (spread spectrum) through the rapid and randomized frequency emitted. LPI characteristic comes from the fact that these frequencies are emitted low energy over wideband, rather than high energy over a narrow frequency range. Your emission would just blend into background noise.

A question: J-36's EW and radar/sensor capabilities have been widely discussed and emphasized. But wouldn't these make any plane very detectable and contradict its stealth capabilities?

Modern stealth fighters limit their AESA radar in scanning. They rely on passive or offboard sensors to scan the area, then transmit a narrow beam from their radar for tracking or jamming, limiting their emission from being picked up (vs spreading in every direction for scanning and advertising their location).

This is why the infographics pages back of j-36 flying in front of j-20 and use their side radars for scan and search are just plain wrong, lacking in any fundamental understanding of modern combats. You don't use your stealthiest and most prized platform to bleed RF signals all over the place for dozens if not hundred of modern geolocating capable RWR's in the area to pick up. And you certain do not intentionally fly your aircraft perpenticular to enemy's sensors, exposing your more IR signature vulnerable side.

And the whole extended supercruising for a flanking maneuver to intercept AWACS and tankers...... I don't even.... oh lord....